Petition going to Senators against amnesty

[Vince]

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breath free.
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me.
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

Different time, different population.

 

[Pete]

I agree with Bob. When we debate this, we need to talk about changing the system.

The SYSTEM is the problem. Have you gone through the process to become a legal citizen of this country. I know people who have - it's long.

They need to change the immigration system first, then discuss what to do with illegal immigrants.

If all these people become legal, it will hurt the business sector because they will have to py minimum wage, benefits, etc. Businesses don't want to do that, and they'll just throw them on the streets and let welfare take care of them.

Deport the ones who aren't making a living, don't talk about amnesty 'til you do.

Bush and the Democrats don't get it.

I don't understand the Democrats stance on the illegals. Basically we have a counter culture of workers who are treated like crap and paid crappy wages. Democrats hate business and claim to love the little man. So by not doing anything they allow business to get a break and people to be treated like crap. Where is the logic?

 

[Pete]

Different time, different population.

and before we had a bazillion social programs.

Also that is inscribed at the Statue of Liberty, where millions of people legally immigrated to the US.

 

[itsbob]

.. and according to flawed research illegal immigrants cost the taxpayers 30 - 50 (or 300 if you believe some number jockeys)billion dollars a year.. but when the flawed research is corrected we find that we have a net surplus of 25 billion dollars a year that illegal immigrants put into the Government coffers above what they use.

 

[BuddyLee]

Either have borders or don't.

Indeed. You can't just go half-way expecting amnesty to solve it all. Enforcing the laws and protecting the borders are key; without one you cannot have the other.

 

[BuddyLee]

I don't understand the Democrats stance on the illegals. Basically we have a counter culture of workers who are treated like crap and paid crappy wages. Democrats hate business and claim to love the little man. So by not doing anything they allow business to get a break and people to be treated like crap. Where is the logic?

You forgot one thing. The Dems also want amnesty and once they obtain this, who do you think this group will vote for?

Anything for the vote...anything.

 

[hvp05]

The Dems also want amnesty and once they obtain this, who do you think this group will vote for?

A few nights ago O'Reilly was saying that the citizenship of the current immigrants - plus another couple tens of millions over the next 20 - 30 years - will nearly annihilate the Republican party. I don't know how true that may be, but if the Left panders enough they could grab the majority.

 

[Pete]

.. and according to flawed research illegal immigrants cost the taxpayers 30 - 50 (or 300 if you believe some number jockeys)billion dollars a year.. but when the flawed research is corrected we find that we have a net surplus of 25 billion dollars a year that illegal immigrants put into the Government coffers above what they use.

Bob you have to admit by skirting the income taxes both federal and state they do end up costing taxpayers a ton of money.

My dad is basically out of business in Georgia because they flood the construction market. They do not buy Workman's comp or withhold taxes. Local small builders cannot compete.

They fill the local schools with their kids who do not speak English and require extra bi-lingual teachers.

If they get sick or injured they go to the emergency room under assumed names. If they are on the job and get injured they drive them buy the Emergency room and drop them off. Miguel Rodriguez LXCII goes in and gets treated free.

They do pay sales tax but they consume little. Ever seen a flop house? They will rent a trailer and put 20 people in there. Violations of the health codes everywhere. How does a septic system designed for 4 people handle 20?

The anchor babies qualify for WIC, TANF and Food Stamps yet the illegal parents do not pay in.

They do consume way more tax dollars than they consume.

 

[Pete]

A few nights ago O'Reilly was saying that the citizenship of the current immigrants - plus another couple tens of millions over the next 20 - 30 years - will nearly annihilate the Republican party. I don't know how true that may be, but if the Left panders enough they could grab the majority.

It's possible but there has to be some take, we cannot give give give.

 

[hvp05]

They do consume way more tax dollars than they consume.

As I said earlier, I don't care what the total amount is... it's too much. Even if there is an economic surplus, are we supposed to ignore the principle of the law?

 

[Pandora]

I have to lean towards Bob’s opinion here. I file paperwork to have people deported at least twice per month, succeed, only to have them return in about 10 days or so. It is a relentless revolving door.

In a perfect world, we would deport them and secure our borders, since I have no confidence that is going to happen, I tend to think offering amnesty is a plausible solution.

There are several locations in Southern Maryland where the illegals have taken up occupancy in the woods and the police are well aware of that fact. I have made jokes about calling immigration, getting a voice message telling me to press 1 for Law Enforcement and to leave a message. Press 2 if you are just a concerned citizen filing a compliant and you'll be given the address to write in your compliant. The truth is, that is no joke. That is exactly how it is.

 

[hvp05]

In a perfect world, we would deport them and secure our borders, since I have no confidence that is going to happen, I tend to think offering amnesty is a plausible solution.

I would rather have the government take longer to secure the border properly - which will ultimately have a positive result - than to give a quick amnesty just for the sake of doing something - which could be disastrous later.

Would you grant amnesty to those already here or to everybody wanting to come in (i.e., open border)?

 

[Pandora]

I would rather have the government take longer to secure the border properly - which will ultimately have a positive result - than to give a quick amnesty just for the sake of doing something - which could be disastrous later.

Would you grant amnesty to those already here or to everybody wanting to come in (i.e., open border)?

You know, it is a tough call. Our borders have gone poorly maintained for too long and who knows how many of those suckers are over in this country. Like already mentioned, these people can live stacked on each other. They pull up at the local WAWA in the morning, open the door and they just keep coming out of the vehicle, one after another.

Where would you detail these people? Who is going to pay to have them all deported? And are they going to put proper measures in place to keep them from returning?

Of course the amnesty process itself is going to require paperwork and maybe even ensuring they are not wanted anywhere for anything but if they are here, they should pay taxes, like the rest of us and learn our language.

 

[hvp05]

Our borders have gone poorly maintained for too long

I hate to say it... but I do feel like the U.S. deserves some amount of stress because the government allowed the situation to become this extended. They are now trying to correct something that has been within their control the entire time.

Where would you detail these people? Who is going to pay to have them all deported? And are they going to put proper measures in place to keep them from returning?

The last question should be the first to be answered. Once they lock it down they can move on to dealing with the individuals already here. And dealing with them could become the next boom in government work, like after 9/11, specialists could be trained and hired to handle the millions of deportees.

if they are here, they should pay taxes, like the rest of us and learn our language.

Absolutely. Some effort on their part to prove that they want to truly be Americans would go a long way towards acceptance.

 

[Pete]

So you put up a big fence. What is to stop them from loading up a boat and going out to sea a mile or two and then coming ashore in Texas 4 or 5 miles from the border? It is a hell of a problem.

 

[hvp05]

What is to stop them from loading up a boat and going out to sea a mile or two and then coming ashore in Texas 4 or 5 miles from the border?

The Coast Guard has been fairly effective at intercepting Haitians. :shrug:

 

[2ndAmendment]

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breath free.
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me.
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

Yep! As long as you come in by the system in place and not illegally.

 

[2ndAmendment]

I changed my mind, let's go!

Take a check out of petty cash.

 

[2ndAmendment]

You know, it is a tough call. Our borders have gone poorly maintained for too long and who knows how many of those suckers are over in this country. Like already mentioned, these people can live stacked on each other. They pull up at the local WAWA in the morning, open the door and they just keep coming out of the vehicle, one after another.

Where would you detail these people? Who is going to pay to have them all deported? And are they going to put proper measures in place to keep them from returning?

Of course the amnesty process itself is going to require paperwork and maybe even ensuring they are not wanted anywhere for anything but if they are here, they should pay taxes, like the rest of us and learn our language.

Like I posted earlier, make the penalty for coming in illegally very, very high. You come in illegally:

• Guilty of felony - no hope to get in legally - serve 5 years minimum at labor and then deported
• Have a kid here illegally - Kid stays, you get tossed out.
• Come in illegally a second time - treated as an invader - POW camp - shot at dawn

That would make the consequence so high that they would not want to risk coming here illegally.

Harsh? Yes. Absolutely. But it seems the illegals do not understand nice.

 

[Makavide]

Like I posted earlier, make the penalty for coming in illegally very, very high. You come in illegally:

• Guilty of felony - no hope to get in legally - serve 5 years minimum at labor and then deported
• Have a kid here illegally - Kid stays, you get tossed out.
• Come in illegally a second time - treated as an invader - POW camp - shot at dawn

That would make the consequence so high that they would not want to risk coming here illegally.

Harsh? Yes. Absolutely. But it seems the illegals do not understand nice.

You need to take it one step further:
- rent to an illegal - lose your property
- hire an illigal - lose your business
- fail to collect taxes - large fine
until we really quit giving the illegals a reason to come to this country, then we will always have this problem.

By just going after the illegals, you are just punishing the "addicts". We need to get the "pushers/suppliers" off the streets as well.