Kinnakeet
Well-Known Member
Do you work at the fishing pier baiting hooks with that masters if so that makes you a master....lol
The School crisis is about to go Defcon 4
- Thread starter Hessian
- Start date
sparkyaclown
Active Member
I agree, they don't get paid enough, as an example I will use my wife who is a teacher. One year I tracked the number of hours she put into teaching (grading, lesson planning, and the gov. bs paperwork they have to do, etc.) and calculated it vs. her salary. In the end she made less than $10 an hour and put in more than double the hours anyone in a normal full time job does in an entire year. So in reality, she could've worked at McDonalds and put in the same number of hours without any of the stress.
All of the teachers I know are not complaining about the pay though. The biggest complaints I have heard are, behavior issues with parents often being worse than the child themselves and workloads that are impossible to complete without consuming hours of their personal time. These people are under a lot of stress to get their part done with no time to really decompress and relax. Teachers often get no support from the parents when their child isn't performing and instead get hit with the "what are you (the teacher) doing to inspire my child to work" speech. New teachers are leaving because they can make the same or better pay somewhere else and not have to deal with all of the headaches.
All of the teachers I know are not complaining about the pay though. The biggest complaints I have heard are, behavior issues with parents often being worse than the child themselves and workloads that are impossible to complete without consuming hours of their personal time. These people are under a lot of stress to get their part done with no time to really decompress and relax. Teachers often get no support from the parents when their child isn't performing and instead get hit with the "what are you (the teacher) doing to inspire my child to work" speech. New teachers are leaving because they can make the same or better pay somewhere else and not have to deal with all of the headaches.
tipsymcgee
Active Member
FWIW, my older daughter in private school does have homework, although less than what she had pre-COVID. My other two in public school have just about zero homework, though. And I mean literally zero. I have no idea if this makes it tougher or easier on the teacher's work schedule, though.
JMO, I've always thought the education required for teachers and admin was ridiculous, especially those at younger age levels. If they wanna teach, a 2-year degree should be more than enough for teaching kids under 10. If high schools require more, so be it. And, no, I will not address any admin as Doctor, ever. Sorry.
JMO, I've always thought the education required for teachers and admin was ridiculous, especially those at younger age levels. If they wanna teach, a 2-year degree should be more than enough for teaching kids under 10. If high schools require more, so be it. And, no, I will not address any admin as Doctor, ever. Sorry.
LtownTaxpayer
Active Member
In your previous posts, you acted like you know everything about education and teaching. I guess not.
In Maryland, it is an MSDE requirement (codified in COMAR) that teacher keep taking classes in order to maintain their certification. Sometimes the tuition reimbursement covers that cost, but it does not cover books or fees for the classes. Many teachers take courses in the summer so they can focus on their classrooms, grading, prepping, and trying to have a bit of downtime during the school year. There is never enough paid time during the school day to do all of what a teacher needs to do to be effective so that time ends up being volunteered. In addition, some schools require teachers to cover at least one additional activity (many times unpaid - thus "volunteer"). It could be a tutoring club, chess, or different activities.
In Maryland textbooks are chosen by the local school district. They have to be selected by school personnel (including admin, supervisors, teachers) and available for parental review. Depending on the subject, this can be a time intensive process.
I have found that many people think they know how schools/education work because they were once in school. They are wrong. Education is entirely different even since the early 2000s. Making comments about something you do not understand doesn't help anyone. I can remember reading a letter to the editor in the "Emptyprize" complaining that there were entirely too many big fancy cars in the parking lot at LHS/Tech Center. The author clearly didn't know that most of those fancy cars were being driven by the LHS students.
Tex
In response to your 1st sentence.
Everyone of the items that you point out in your post was implemented by " YOUR PEERS" If your peers implemented them then your peers can rescind them. My advice to you is GET CRACKEN if you don't like them.
Clem72
Well-Known Member
Teachers of younger kids, lets say up to 5th or 6th grade, definitely need a ton of training. But not the type they get right now, they need some kind of SERE or R2I training to keep their fight or flight reactions in check and make sure they are resistent to the torture inflicted by having to be in the presense of 20-30 kids for 8 hours a day.
Sneakers
Just sneakin' around....
I got a cracken once. But I released it.
I'm still inn the hunt
LightRoasted
If I may ...
For your consideration ...
I know everything related to what public school teachers and the system is detrimentally doing to the future adults of the Nation. Failing them and setting then up for failure in life. The individual critical thinker sees through all the teacher's and union's BS. Including yours. 'Woe is me, I suffer so much, please have pity on me as a teacher and pay me more while reducing my work load.' People are tired of it and are beginning to have enough.
So .... someone made something that shouldn't be complicated, complicated. Maintain certification? So once certified isn't good enough huh? Pretty much you guys are kinda like real estate agents then. So I was correct then. It's unnecessary make work to further oil the skids for the demands for higher pay, using the, "Oh, we have to constantly maintain certifications and continuing education while teaching Suzie and Johnie and cut out some summer days too."
And how do you think it became "codified in COMAR" to begin with? Your unions lobbied the legislature with it in mind to use it as a bargaining chip come negotiations to extort more money from the taxpayers.
Waaaaa Waaaaa Waaaaa.
Btw. Don't think many elementary or middle school kids are driving nice new cars and SUV's to school much these days.
"In your previous posts, you acted like you know everything about education and teaching. I guess not."
I know everything related to what public school teachers and the system is detrimentally doing to the future adults of the Nation. Failing them and setting then up for failure in life. The individual critical thinker sees through all the teacher's and union's BS. Including yours. 'Woe is me, I suffer so much, please have pity on me as a teacher and pay me more while reducing my work load.' People are tired of it and are beginning to have enough.
So .... someone made something that shouldn't be complicated, complicated. Maintain certification? So once certified isn't good enough huh? Pretty much you guys are kinda like real estate agents then. So I was correct then. It's unnecessary make work to further oil the skids for the demands for higher pay, using the, "Oh, we have to constantly maintain certifications and continuing education while teaching Suzie and Johnie and cut out some summer days too."
And how do you think it became "codified in COMAR" to begin with? Your unions lobbied the legislature with it in mind to use it as a bargaining chip come negotiations to extort more money from the taxpayers.
Waaaaa Waaaaa Waaaaa.
Btw. Don't think many elementary or middle school kids are driving nice new cars and SUV's to school much these days.
jrt_ms1995
Well-Known Member
Only when there's just one of us. Maybe.
BOP
Well-Known Member
At Mickey D's, she'd be at risk of customers going on "chimpy" on them.
LightRoasted
If I may ...
For your consideration ...
If, just as with any other industry, "teachers" truly wanted and demanded change as we are told they seek, safe classrooms, disobedient kids suspended, trouble makers removed, discipline restored, the dumping of woke indoctrination BS, then, as others have done, petition, and strike if necessary, without their union's consent, to effect those changes. But we all know that won't happen, because, the majority of "teachers" only think about themselves and what is in it for them.
Now, a couple fun facts about K-12 teachers.
In 2020, before the lockdowns, the NIH completed and released a study on obesity by profession and K-12 teacher is one of the highest. 85% obese. 33% already in real cardiac trouble. Prior to that in 2018, Monica et al found the rate was a bit over 70% for female teachers. Most of them were middle class and most of them were <55. Yet 70% were obese. All the research points out that this is terrible because it's normalizing obesity for children and is highly correlated with increasing rates of childhood obesity and childhood Type 2 diabetes (which wasn't even a thing, really, 15 years ago).
Now, let's ask a question here. Yeah, it's gonna suck if you're fat but maybe it's what you need to hear.
What sort of person becomes obese? Not just fat, not just a bit overweight, obese, which is clinically defined as either a BMI >30 or 50 or more pounds overweight based on your height and other measurements. (And no, it's not actually possible to "game the system" and end up with Arnold in his prime being "obese" because of muscle. That's not the way this works, that's a dumbass Lefty fatgirl argument.)
The point being that you have to really let yourself go to end up as obese. And most of the people who are obese in these studies are not "a little obese" or "close to the line". They're way, way, way past the line. In fact, they may have eaten the line at some point.
What does that mean? It means that the vast majority of your K-12 teachers have a series of significant issues. They lack discipline and they don't much care about themselves, so it's unsurprising that they wouldn't care much about the kids. Mostly they're probably not that smart either (Have you talked to any of them? They're mostly retards actually.) And woke? Oh my God are they woke! Carrying and promoting every banner antithetical to what was once considered moral and normal.
But worse than that, obesity has several factors about it that actually make obesity itself a vicious cycle. Obese people, "teachers", feel like shiat all the time. Many of them don't even know it because they've felt so bad for so long that feeling terrible is their baseline. Don't believe it? Just ask someone who's lost a ton of weight. They can't shut up about how much better they feel and how they didn't know this was even possible.
This tends to lead to a myriad of problems including depression. Depressed people tend not to seek betterment of themselves or others, tend to become mentally exhausted quickly and are generally grumpy. They also tend to have low self esteem which is strongly correlated with "taking others down" to make themselves feel better.
So, you've got a bunch of midwit fatties with both physical and emotional health problems running the schools in a passive aggressive manner while promoting a whole variety of damaging lifestyle choices to the children under their care to make themselves feel better. At the same time the whole system for bringing in new teachers has been hijacked to select people, [under the guise of diversity, equity and inclusion], who are not the smartest, best and brightest, and also display sociopathic tendencies. What part of this sounds like a good idea?
And these people, "teachers", now so called "educators", want us to respect them when they don't even respect themselves, or the autonomy of the children they "teach" nor of the parents?
It is far past time for parents and the taxpayers to begin to stand up to these crybaby passive aggressive bullies. As well as to pull their children out of the child abusive public school system and home school, or send them to a private or parochial schools that have values that match their own.
Ahhh, ummmm. In case you haven't noticed, "teachers" are part of, integral and quintessential to, the "system", duh. How many "teachers" run for school boards using the fact they are a "teacher" which makes them supposedly more than eminently qualified to be elected to such a board? Just look to Calvert and St. Mary's counties Board of Education races for that confirmation. How many prior "teachers" are heads of, or have positions in, "teachers" unions? So yes. It is most definitely the "teachers" that are "screwed up".Perhaps it is the SYSTEM that is screwed up and not the teachers? As shown by what I highlighted above. Unless you are saying that teachers have been screwed up since YOU were in school.
If, just as with any other industry, "teachers" truly wanted and demanded change as we are told they seek, safe classrooms, disobedient kids suspended, trouble makers removed, discipline restored, the dumping of woke indoctrination BS, then, as others have done, petition, and strike if necessary, without their union's consent, to effect those changes. But we all know that won't happen, because, the majority of "teachers" only think about themselves and what is in it for them.
Now, a couple fun facts about K-12 teachers.
In 2020, before the lockdowns, the NIH completed and released a study on obesity by profession and K-12 teacher is one of the highest. 85% obese. 33% already in real cardiac trouble. Prior to that in 2018, Monica et al found the rate was a bit over 70% for female teachers. Most of them were middle class and most of them were <55. Yet 70% were obese. All the research points out that this is terrible because it's normalizing obesity for children and is highly correlated with increasing rates of childhood obesity and childhood Type 2 diabetes (which wasn't even a thing, really, 15 years ago).
Now, let's ask a question here. Yeah, it's gonna suck if you're fat but maybe it's what you need to hear.
What sort of person becomes obese? Not just fat, not just a bit overweight, obese, which is clinically defined as either a BMI >30 or 50 or more pounds overweight based on your height and other measurements. (And no, it's not actually possible to "game the system" and end up with Arnold in his prime being "obese" because of muscle. That's not the way this works, that's a dumbass Lefty fatgirl argument.)
The point being that you have to really let yourself go to end up as obese. And most of the people who are obese in these studies are not "a little obese" or "close to the line". They're way, way, way past the line. In fact, they may have eaten the line at some point.
What does that mean? It means that the vast majority of your K-12 teachers have a series of significant issues. They lack discipline and they don't much care about themselves, so it's unsurprising that they wouldn't care much about the kids. Mostly they're probably not that smart either (Have you talked to any of them? They're mostly retards actually.) And woke? Oh my God are they woke! Carrying and promoting every banner antithetical to what was once considered moral and normal.
But worse than that, obesity has several factors about it that actually make obesity itself a vicious cycle. Obese people, "teachers", feel like shiat all the time. Many of them don't even know it because they've felt so bad for so long that feeling terrible is their baseline. Don't believe it? Just ask someone who's lost a ton of weight. They can't shut up about how much better they feel and how they didn't know this was even possible.
This tends to lead to a myriad of problems including depression. Depressed people tend not to seek betterment of themselves or others, tend to become mentally exhausted quickly and are generally grumpy. They also tend to have low self esteem which is strongly correlated with "taking others down" to make themselves feel better.
So, you've got a bunch of midwit fatties with both physical and emotional health problems running the schools in a passive aggressive manner while promoting a whole variety of damaging lifestyle choices to the children under their care to make themselves feel better. At the same time the whole system for bringing in new teachers has been hijacked to select people, [under the guise of diversity, equity and inclusion], who are not the smartest, best and brightest, and also display sociopathic tendencies. What part of this sounds like a good idea?
And these people, "teachers", now so called "educators", want us to respect them when they don't even respect themselves, or the autonomy of the children they "teach" nor of the parents?
It is far past time for parents and the taxpayers to begin to stand up to these crybaby passive aggressive bullies. As well as to pull their children out of the child abusive public school system and home school, or send them to a private or parochial schools that have values that match their own.
OccamsRazor
Well-Known Member
Jesus! What a screed!
So your point is that the whole system would be perfect if school systems partnered with WW?
At one time you might have found those salaries in large suburban districts outside Philly - the "middle class burbs". But the right to strike was modified and I think that pulled down the salaries a bit.
I will only say that teachers were accountable and accessible. For the most part, very professional. Administrators wanted to go back into the classrooms because the pay was on par or better than what they were getting.
But with the law changing and school enrollment dropping in many districts, I think pay slid down as teachers retired.
Our district high school was ranked on a par with the top prep schools, if that is any indication on how well the public schools were performing in the area.
But, the BOE was elected and had the ability to tax. But that also made them fully and solely accountable to the residents.
You get what you pay for, if well managed.
Hessian
Well-Known Member
Lightroasted..."Mostly they're probably not that smart either (Have you talked to any of them? They're mostly retards actually.) And woke? Oh my God are they woke! Carrying and promoting every banner antithetical to what was once considered moral and normal."
This sentence....yes, a blend of hyperbole...accuracy...brutal 2x4-to-the-head epiphany....
I sort of wish it was re-written to bring in more accuracy, but there are some painful truths behind the hyperbole.
I think if parents read that, they would be ordering homeschool textbooks right now....(and that is still a wise approach)
This sentence....yes, a blend of hyperbole...accuracy...brutal 2x4-to-the-head epiphany....
I sort of wish it was re-written to bring in more accuracy, but there are some painful truths behind the hyperbole.
I think if parents read that, they would be ordering homeschool textbooks right now....(and that is still a wise approach)
PeoplesElbow
Well-Known Member
It actually is possible to game the system, I knew someone very fat, but because their neck measurement is used in the calculation they were considered athletic. It all depends where the weight is.
Army Body Fat Calculator
This calculator computes body fat percentage using methods from the Army Body Fat Assessment of the Army Body Composition Program.
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TPD
the poor dad
This is an interesting analysis. I need to pay a bit more attention to our local teachers to see how much truth there is to this...
sparkyaclown
Active Member
Actually, it came from a some parents of children in the inner city schools who believed that teachers were the reason their children weren't performing and so the government, not the teachers and their unions, came up with "we'll make them go through a certification that they have to keep renewing". I assure you no teacher or union lobbied for a certification. The most the union did was tell them that the school boards need to absorb the tuition costs after they implemented their bright idea.
LightRoasted
If I may ...
For your consideration ...
Ask any real estate agent if their biennial continuing education certification costs to maintain their real estate sales licence are ever reimbursed by their broker. Doesn't happen. Because it is the agent's personal responsibility to keep their licence current. Why should "teachers" be treated any different? Why aren't "teachers" responsible for their own certification costs? Maybe "teachers" don't know how to be responsible because they are always pampered and coddled like children and with enough whining are given that cookie from the cookie jar?
Also known as the taxpayers. Why should taxpayers pay for any related educational requirements, regardless of how they were implemented or came about? Then, after the taxpayer pays for this "certification", "teachers" can demand more pay. Rinse, wash, repeat. I don't believe for a minute that "teachers" unions somehow didn't have a hand in this. It is part and parcel of the liberal playbook using deception, contrivances, and subterfuge to get to their end goal, which is ALWAYS about moar money.
Ask any real estate agent if their biennial continuing education certification costs to maintain their real estate sales licence are ever reimbursed by their broker. Doesn't happen. Because it is the agent's personal responsibility to keep their licence current. Why should "teachers" be treated any different? Why aren't "teachers" responsible for their own certification costs? Maybe "teachers" don't know how to be responsible because they are always pampered and coddled like children and with enough whining are given that cookie from the cookie jar?