Why We Are Still Arguing About Darwin

[Larry Gude]

Does...

...everyone accept that a sperm and an egg bond together to start what we call a human being?

If so, does everyone accept that a sperm and an egg, while very much living things, are neither a human being?

If so, does everyone accept that some pretty amazing things happen between conception and it's growth into a human being?

If so, what's so difficult to accept about us evolving from little squirts and dribs and drabs of life and, with some heat and light and nutrition and time, the sperm and the egg, by accident or design or coincidence or whatever, became what they are and then beget us?

I mean, missing link? Make a chart that is a sperm and an egg on one side and a human being on the other. Seems pretty easy to see quite a gulf between the two, not just one thing missing but millions, yet we readily accept, I am assuming, that one side of the chart goes right to the other, right?

So, whatever happened over time, light, heat, food and so on, the mighty sperm and the wondrous egg succeeded, or a chain of successes became each, where quite a few other organisms became this and that and the other thing and, probably, quite few things never made it past that first little spark of energy, like touching metal in winter, an instant of life, then gone.

It's always interesting to me to see people who, on the one side, need the explanation of a miracle to explain our existence and, on the other, need some sort of orderly set of facts to explain us.

To me, #### happens. And, in our case, it became human beings.

Here's to us, God or Darwin or pure accident and all points in between!

 

[Toxick]

...everyone accept that a sperm and an egg bond together to start what we call a human being?

Absolutely ####ing not.


Everyone knows that when a man and woman discover that they love each other, they hug and kiss, and the love is so intense that it actually makes another person in the womans belly.


I know not about this sperm and egg of which you speak.

Eggs are for breakfast.

 

[Xaquin44]

Those are the best two posts ever hehe

 

[GWguy]

...everyone accept that a sperm and an egg bond together to start what we call a human being?

If so, does everyone accept that a sperm and an egg, while very much living things, are neither a human being?

If so, does everyone accept that some pretty amazing things happen between conception and it's growth into a human being?

If so, what's so difficult to accept about us evolving from little squirts and dribs and drabs of life and, with some heat and light and nutrition and time, the sperm and the egg, by accident or design or coincidence or whatever, became what they are and then beget us?

I mean, missing link? Make a chart that is a sperm and an egg on one side and a human being on the other. Seems pretty easy to see quite a gulf between the two, not just one thing missing but millions, yet we readily accept, I am assuming, that one side of the chart goes right to the other, right?

So, whatever happened over time, light, heat, food and so on, the mighty sperm and the wondrous egg succeeded, or a chain of successes became each, where quite a few other organisms became this and that and the other thing and, probably, quite few things never made it past that first little spark of energy, like touching metal in winter, an instant of life, then gone.

It's always interesting to me to see people who, on the one side, need the explanation of a miracle to explain our existence and, on the other, need some sort of orderly set of facts to explain us.

To me, #### happens. And, in our case, it became human beings.

Here's to us, God or Darwin or pure accident and all points in between!

That is some incredible thought, and I tend to agree with you. What happened has happened. We personally were not there. Anything else is just speculation.

 

[Larry Gude]

I put...

Eggs are for breakfast.

...4 of them in my lasagna I made last night. Does that make it OK to eat lasagna for breakfast?

 

[Xaquin44]

breakfast lasagna my good fellow

eggs, crumbled bacon, hash browns, cheese, sauteed onion, chipped beef gravy, and those flaky biscuts seperated to make the 'noodles'




IT IS BREAKFAST EVOLVED!

 

[Larry Gude]

We don't have...

We personally were not there. Anything else is just speculation.

...to be there. If as tree feel in the woods and no one saw it, it still fell.

Some incredible things happen in nature. Look at a pine thicket. Why are some of them mostly perfect, some kinda not so much, others nearly mutant and why does it end? What happened where the soil and all the other environmental conditions suddenly weren't right and the thicket just ends in what seems like an area exactly like the area in the middle of the thicket? Is that the exact spot where it's just a bit to far North or South for the specie to survive?

Was it the wind? Not quite enough firmness in the earth? Did some animals tend to pizz in those spots? Or not pizz? Was it an area of run off at some point? Is the subsoil just a bit different in that area? And why is that?

I mean, a man and a woman can have sex 100 times and she doesn't conceive. Then, bammo, pretty much everything is the exact same and, boom, you've got something to do for 18 years. There are dominant traits in all sorts of things that make it live or not hold up. Or live when this is right and not make it when that's not right. Natural selection, the perfection of nature, isn't perfect.

A gazelle that might not have survived in leaner times, makes it through a wetter year and goes on to be one of the strongest of the herd and passes on a trait or two that a stronger yet dumber gazelle maybe didn't have. Maybe this one has just a bit quicker reflexes? Or can sense danger a bit quicker? Multiply those scenarios out over countless generations and apply them across the board from the lowliest amoeba to what may or may not be a stronger one.

Look at underwater, deep sea venting, volcanic activity. Something planed that, too? There's an explanation that is full proof? Look at the toxicity and how does that affect the things that adapt to live near a vent? How does it affect a life form across the ocean that needs just a pinch more sulfur to thrive rather than the intense concentrations something else needed or adapted to near the vent.

A life form could be as simple as some odd ocean current of goop that shifted patterns after a lithospheric or tectonic plate suddenly moved and the goop got hit by lightening several times and, viola, the combination of salinity, temperature and everything else plus a jolt of electricity brought something to life and then it set about growing and multiplying and adapting over millions of years.

Life is not orderly, though it can be. Science isn't always exact. I mean, it is, ultimately, but it can reach an irrelevant specificity. On how deep of a level do we really need to know why lasagna is the best stuff on earth? It just is.

Religious text offer a nice, neat little package to fill in all the sticky questions. Science says all the answers are out there; we just haven;t found them all yet.

I asked a man once why he believes in God and he said, obviously haven given it great and deep thought, that he believed in God because he didn't like the idea that we grew out of some swamp muck. Personally, I see it as a compliment to us.

But, I am an optimist. No idea why. Just am.

 

[Larry Gude]

Sounds...

breakfast lasagna my good fellow

eggs, crumbled bacon, hash browns, cheese, sauteed onion, chipped beef gravy, and those flaky biscuts seperated to make the 'noodles'




IT IS BREAKFAST EVOLVED!

...more like an accident of nature to me. Or an attempt to use up leftovers.

 

[Xaquin44]

It's so good.

Just don't eat too much because it probably puts burger king breakfast to shame calorie wise

 

[GWguy]

...to be there. If as tree feel in the woods and no one saw it, it still fell.

Yes, but HOW did it fall? Was it pushed over? Did a mammoth rub it's butt? Did it die of natural causes? Did God's hand strike it down? Those are the things that make for continued debates on science vs. religion.

And no, I do NOT want to get into a debate with you. I'll lose before the first volley is fired....

 

[Larry Gude]

All well and...

Yes, but HOW did it fall? Was it pushed over? Did a mammoth rub it's butt? Did it die of natural causes? Did God's hand strike it down? Those are the things that make for continued debates on science vs. religion.

...good and that is happy truth. Can you imagine how much it would suck if we knew, fact certain, which side was right?

My point is only that it did in fact fall and it fell however it fell. It probably didn't fall because some God had it in for it though if there is a God He certainly can knock trees over if he can make them and whatever explanation science comes up with will be perfectly correct and reasonable as far as the data collected and interpretations go and may well be completely wrong as to the truth.

 

[Vince]

Easy.

If The Origin of Species is right, the the Bible is wrong.

The Bible is not wrong, so The Origin of Species is wrong.

Deduction my dear Watson.

That works.

 

[Xaquin44]

That works.

It only works if you willingly disregard logic.

 

[MMDad]

...everyone accept that a sperm and an egg bond together to start what we call a human being?

...4 of them in my lasagna I made last night. Does that make it OK to eat lasagna for breakfast?

As long as it was just the eggs, and not that other stuff, I think you're okay.

 

[This_person]

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/06/science/06fossil.html

So they found a prehistoric frog? :shrug:

 

[This_person]

At least science attempts to explain things as opposed to an invisible man did it .... and years later made men write a book to loosely explain it SO IT MUST BE RIGHT!

I think the "invisible man" comments are the types of things Lugnut was talking about when he was talking about offensive comments. But, that one is offensive to Christians, so it must be okay???

 

[This_person]

The science of evolution is not "made up". If there is something about science that is "made up" it is a hypothesis which is an idea based in logic that is from observable data and experimentaion. If the experimentation is reapeatable and the predictions are shown to be true, then it basically becomes a theory.


Theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Not only is evolution seen in nature as with fossils and living examples, but it is also observable in the laboratory and the experiments can be repeated showing the predictions to be true thereby supporting the theory even further.
Evolution has been observed actually happening.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26lab.html

Let me rephrase what you wrote as I read it:

Evolution is an unproven theory that has been observed sometimes with animals other than humans. There are great differences between virtually all other animals and humans (sentience ((sp?))), so it really means nothing towards humans.

 

[This_person]

...everyone accept that a sperm and an egg bond together to start what we call a human being?

If so, does everyone accept that a sperm and an egg, while very much living things, are neither a human being?

If so, does everyone accept that some pretty amazing things happen between conception and it's growth into a human being?

If so, what's so difficult to accept about us evolving from little squirts and dribs and drabs of life and, with some heat and light and nutrition and time, the sperm and the egg, by accident or design or coincidence or whatever, became what they are and then beget us?

I mean, missing link? Make a chart that is a sperm and an egg on one side and a human being on the other. Seems pretty easy to see quite a gulf between the two, not just one thing missing but millions, yet we readily accept, I am assuming, that one side of the chart goes right to the other, right?

So, whatever happened over time, light, heat, food and so on, the mighty sperm and the wondrous egg succeeded, or a chain of successes became each, where quite a few other organisms became this and that and the other thing and, probably, quite few things never made it past that first little spark of energy, like touching metal in winter, an instant of life, then gone.

It's always interesting to me to see people who, on the one side, need the explanation of a miracle to explain our existence and, on the other, need some sort of orderly set of facts to explain us.

To me, #### happens. And, in our case, it became human beings.

Here's to us, God or Darwin or pure accident and all points in between!

This argument would make sense if and only if the egg and sperm occurred without the growth of the human. You're talking about how life is formed within life (a miracle everyday), not how life came out of mucky water.

 

[Larry Gude]

Oh...

This argument would make sense if and only if the egg and sperm occurred without the growth of the human. You're talking about how life is formed within life (a miracle everyday), not how life came out of mucky water.

...look!

So, what came first, the chicken or the egg?

 

[This_person]

...look!

So, what came first, the chicken or the egg?

The rooster, to fertilize the egg!