Bills @ Skins

[DoWhat]

The players all played with heavy hearts today and I salute them for doing as well as they did.

Do you really feel that`way?
I think they played like $hit.

 

[MMDad]

Please explain to me why it is cheating?? Its been done for YEARS, just the timing is different now. Why is it considered cheating?? I don't like it but all this hubbub about cheating is crazy, its legit to call a timeout any time you want, even if its a millisecond before the snap. Do you gripe when the defense calls a timeout a split second before the snap because they have too many people on the field when a field goal is not involved??? whats the difference??

I know it is legal. I've never liked it. The reason to do it is solely to psych the kicker. That's what I don't like. It's a cheap move.

Yes, everyone does it, and it is legal. I wish they'd change the rule.

 

[vanbells]

What a crappy way to lose!!! A fight broke out as I left the game. (No surprise) I did get a towel with Sean Taylor number on it though.

 

[Otter]

I know it is legal. I've never liked it. The reason to do it is solely to psych the kicker. That's what I don't like. It's a cheap move.

Yes, everyone does it, and it is legal. I wish they'd change the rule.

But so many people refer to it as cheating..freezing the kicker out has been around since I started following football in the early 60s..Its just the timing thats different now, where they call a timeout just before the snap.

It's always been part of football..why do people insist that it is cheating??(and I'm not directing this question to just MMdad)...Splain yourself, DoWhat

 

[DoWhat]

Splain yourself, DoWhat

Don't be jumping on my fat as$.
I said it was dirty.
Waiting milliseconds prior to the snap.
Kicker gets the field goal only to find out that they called a timeout.

 

[Otter]

Don't be jumping on my fat as$.
I said it was dirty.
Waiting milliseconds prior to the snap.
Kicker gets the field goal only to find out that they called a timeout.

Maybe I was mistaken, I thought you were one that was referring to calling a timeout as cheating..my bad..but I've heard so many people say that and I don't understand their reasoning as to why they think its cheating..Is it dirty play if a defense calls timeout, for any reason, a split second before a team rushes for a TD?

 

[dems4me]

He played dirty football by calling the first time out.

Again, I don't call it dirty football, just a team "icing" the kicker. I have this tivo'd and watched it all again after this thread speculation of Gibbs calling a time out "milliseconds" before the kick... it's clearly shown as Gibbs calling a time out well before the ball was even snapped.

 

[DoWhat]

Maybe I was mistaken, I thought you were one that was referring to calling a timeout as cheating..my bad..but I've heard so many people say that and I don't understand their reasoning as to why they think its cheating..Is it dirty play if a defense calls timeout, for any reason, a split second before a team rushes for a TD?

Never called it cheating.
I just feel that it's wrong calling a` timeout at the last second. (F'n with the kicker)

 

[Coventry17]

...in hell.

Burn this thing to the ground; get rid of Portis, Moss, Jansen, Landry, Campbell, Saunders, Williams, Fletcher, Griffin, Samuels, Randl El, absolute fire sale, all the coaches, and get as many draft picks as we can get our hands on and hire some young 40 year old hot shot and tell him to build a team and win or fire him and hire someone else.

Fire sale.

Oh, don't worry, the salary cap is going to do that for you. The Redskins have the least amount of salary cap room this year and next year they are projected to be $25 million OVER the cap. Welcome to salary cap hell, Danny Boy.

 

[Inkpen]

Would it had made a difference IF there was no second time out called, thus no penalty..and a closer field goal?
Would the Bills had made that 51 yard filed goal?

I cant believe they lost as they did.
Maybe Thursday they can win!

 

[Coventry17]

Ummm..Does my husband count?
Hope so..I DO know it is very hard to move forward...esp with a 9 yo child!!

But the team was all hyped up to WIN the game for Sean..and not only did they let the TEAM down, they let Sean down.

Many teams in other sports have played hard for a fallen team mate....

And Larry is right, they played the same this week as last week without Sean, and the week before WITH Sean.

Yes, death is hard, but many try even harder FOR the loved one they lost.
..................................

It doesn't matter how "hyped up" your team is. The Redskins are not a very good football team. Hype doesn't win games, talent does. They won some games earlier in the year that they shouldn't have and their record was better than the actual talent level of the team. Funny thing, the NFL usually evens all that out eventually. You've got the worst owner in the NFL, the worst GM in the NFL and the most clueless coach in the NFL. Add to that, a rag tag bunch of overpaid free agents and a penchant for bad draft day decisions. There is no rhyme or reason to the fabrication of the roster, there seems to be major turnover every single year and it doesn't help that the fanbase still thinks it's 1987. The sad part? You're going to be worse next year.

 

[OldHillcrestGuy]

...in hell.

Burn this thing to the ground; get rid of Portis, Moss, Jansen, Landry, Campbell, Saunders, Williams, Fletcher, Griffin, Samuels, Randl El, absolute fire sale, all the coaches, and get as many draft picks as we can get our hands on and hire some young 40 year old hot shot and tell him to build a team and win or fire him and hire someone else.

Fire sale.

Not such a bad idea, few years back the Cowboys were lousy, only win they had one season, and correct me if Im wrong DoWhat was againest the Skins, they have rebuilt mainly from draft picks if Im not mistaken.

 

[toppick08]

It doesn't matter how "hyped up" your team is. The Redskins are not a very good football team. Hype doesn't win games, talent does. They won some games earlier in the year that they shouldn't have and their record was better than the actual talent level of the team. Funny thing, the NFL usually evens all that out eventually. You've got the worst owner in the NFL, the worst GM in the NFL and the most clueless coach in the NFL. Add to that, a rag tag bunch of overpaid free agents and a penchant for bad draft day decisions. There is no rhyme or reason to the fabrication of the roster, there seems to be major turnover every single year and it doesn't help that the fanbase still thinks it's 1987. The sad part? You're going to be worse next year.

and I'm a 'Skins fan. The truth hurts.

 

[Larry Gude]

The cheesy...

Please explain to me why it is cheating?? Its been done for YEARS, just the timing is different now. Why is it considered cheating?? I don't like it but all this hubbub about cheating is crazy, its legit to call a timeout any time you want, even if its a millisecond before the snap. Do you gripe when the defense calls a timeout a split second before the snap because they have too many people on the field when a field goal is not involved??? whats the difference??

...part is that nowadays you can tell the ref ahead of time that you want a TO right before the snap so you don't even have to time it right; the ref simply waits for the snap and signals time out. I'm not sure when it was changed but you used to have to actually call the time out before the snap and hope you didn't wait too long, so, the TO used to be before the kicking team was all set. So, that's the difference.

It is not cheating; it is within the rules. Gibbs is bring a bit hypocritical though as earlier in the season he said he wouldn't take advantage of that rule.

 

[Larry Gude]

Oh, please...

Oh, don't worry, the salary cap is going to do that for you. The Redskins have the least amount of salary cap room this year and next year they are projected to be $25 million OVER the cap. Welcome to salary cap hell, Danny Boy.

...where have you been the last three years? The Redskins are synonymous with 'cap problems' and they find a way every year to get around it. The cap is more of a guideline. The Skins have been well over the 'cap' on a regular basis.

 

[Larry Gude]

Nope...

It Hype doesn't win games, talent does.

...coaching wins in the NFL. Talent wise, the Skins are very, very good. Portis, Landry, Taylor (rip) Griffin, Samuels, Raback, Thomas, Fletcher, Springs, Kendall, Betts, Washington, Moss, Randl El, Cooley, Rogers, Campbell, Carter, pretty much all starters by anyone's standards.

What we have is talent that doesn't fit all that well like Portis, a slash-back on a team semi designed to be a power running team. Plus, who builds a defense from the backfield forward? And we have coaching issues and again, it's not talent, it's how it fits together.

 

[fedex]

Wish we could have scored a few more touchdowns..

 

[Coventry17]

...coaching wins in the NFL. Talent wise, the Skins are very, very good. Portis, Landry, Taylor (rip) Griffin, Samuels, Raback, Thomas, Fletcher, Springs, Kendall, Betts, Washington, Moss, Randl El, Cooley, Rogers, Campbell, Carter, pretty much all starters by anyone's standards.

What we have is talent that doesn't fit all that well like Portis, a slash-back on a team semi designed to be a power running team. Plus, who builds a defense from the backfield forward? And we have coaching issues and again, it's not talent, it's how it fits together.

Portis - Once great, now mediocre. 2 yds per carry on 20+ carries yesterday
Landry - Good skills, up and coming, not elite yet
Taylor - Awesome player, but dead
Samuels - A mauler, but inconsistent
Moss - Great wide receiver, but a head case
Randel El - A complimentary WR being paid All - Pro money
Cooley - Outstanding TE
Rogers - A decent CB, nothing more. Drafted too high
Rabach/Thomas - Average lineman towards the end of their careers
Kendall - Overpaid lineman, once outstanding, now average
Betts - Complimentary RB
Campbell - Outstanding young QB, but his knack for falling apart in the clutch should be troubling for Redskins fans
Fletcher - A nice LB, but past his prime

Don't forget Lloyd, who'll be cut this year, but you'll still pay for next year. Brunell, he's still on the hook for next year, although he'll be gone. The Redskins have never been over the salary cap, they have deferred payments on a ton of players. The bill comes due next year, they're up against the wall at this point. The Cowboys were in salary cap hell the year Troy Aikman retired. They had to pay for Aikman, Irvin and Deion Sanders, all of whom were gone. The cap was roughly $84 million and they had $25 million in dead money. The result was three straight 5-11 seasons. Your starting RB was Troy Hambrick and the starting QB was Quincy Carter. Lean times are ahead in D.C.

Therein lies your problem. You have name recognition, but you don't have great talent top to bottom. I don't care that you have (had) four first round draft picks in your defensive backfield. You paid a king's ransom for Springs (see a pattern here?). He's well past his prime and is not very durable.

 

[Larry Gude]

Ok...

Therein lies your problem. You have name recognition, but you don't have great talent top to bottom. I don't care that you have (had) four first round draft picks in your defensive backfield. You paid a king's ransom for Springs (see a pattern here?). He's well past his prime and is not very durable.

...we can have a pissing contest. Look at the roster of the Pats and Colts and Steelers the last four Superbowls and look at their opponents, the Seahawks, the Eagles, the Panthers and the Bears and check off the talent and tell me again that coaching isn't the difference.

Even the Pats this year are little more than average at most positions. It's all about the team playing together and THAT is all about the coaching.

I'll go one more; Give our coaching staff any of those teams and give them our people. Whose gonna have a better record at the end of a season?

Hint; Not us.

 

[Larry Gude]

To further...

...debate;

Portis - Once great, now mediocre. 2 yds per carry on 20+ carries yesterday
Portis wil do just fine again in a system suited to him like Denver or KC or Indy.

Landry - Good skills, up and coming, not elite yet

Taylor - Awesome player, but dead

Samuels - A mauler, but inconsistent
And a four time pro bowler who might get there or be an alternate this year.

Moss - Great wide receiver, but a head case
I don't think h's grat at all but he has talent.

Randel El - A complimentary WR being paid All - Pro money
And he is talented.

Cooley - Outstanding TE

Rogers - A decent CB, nothing more. Drafted too high
He's a very good cover corner. His knock is he drops too many pics or he'd have been to a pro bowl or two by now.

Rabach/Thomas - Average lineman towards the end of their careers
Where we you last year? Thomas is a monster, easily a top five guard. He's the single biggest loss we suffered. Rabach would start for most people.

Kendall - Overpaid lineman, once outstanding, now average. He's not over paid. There is NO such thing in the NFL anymore. Whatever so owner wants to spend is what you are worth. Kendall would start for most teams.

Betts - Complimentary RB
Guess you missed the last 7-8 games last year?

Campbell - Outstanding young QB, but his knack for falling apart in the clutch should be troubling for Redskins fans. Love the guy. He looks to make plays too hard and he'll learn that. You can't teach guys to have the heart to compete to the last. His O line is devastated and he's got no help at WR.

Fletcher - A nice LB, but past his prime.
Not last year he wasn't. He'll start for someone next year.

As a further note, this team loses close games. More than anyone else. A lot more. We have talent. We break down when it matters most and that is coaching.