Explain please

[TimAllen]

my questions were directly in response to Starman's comments, if that helps you.....


as for fossils, you should really just get a science book, somewhere between third and fifth grade level should explain what you are asking

I did not ask where fossils come from.

I am asking you how fossils of sea life, got to the top of mountains?

 

[tommyjones]

I did not ask where fossils come from.

I am asking you how fossils of sea life, got to the top of mountains?

its all in those grade school science books.

plate tectonics, i think it was.....

 

[Starman3000m]

my questions were directly in response to Starman's comments, if that helps you.....
as for fossils, you should really just get a science book, somewhere between third and fifth grade level should explain what you are asking

Hi tommy,

I live in Texas. This whole area was once underwater and we find various fossils of marine species buried in the limestone deposits. Lots of petrified wood and dinosaur skeletal remains are uncovered quite often. As you know, fossils of marine animals and dinosaurs are found throughout the continental U.S. as well as other parts of the earth, proving that those areas were all once underwater.

 

[hvp05]

Very interesting read. Though I didn't finish it, just don't have time to sit and read it through lol.

You'd still be disappointed. I'll save you the time and copy the concluding paragraph...

It is obvious that when all the facts of the Genesis account of the flood are examined that there is no reason to doubt that the ark could easily have carried its intended cargo. The biblical account is not a revision of a Babylonia myth. All the scientific evidence shows that the ark could easily have contained all of the animals that were used to repopulate the earth after the flood

TP has been arguing from more of a - dare I say - liberal biblical interpretation. I don't see much conflict there, since this allows for adjustments and reinterpretation as science has allowed. Obviously pcjohnnyb was curious to find out why and how the literalists justify their belief, in the face of so much conflicting evidence.

Why do they find fossils of clams and fish, and other sea life at the top of mountains?

Here is one example of how that has happened. Over millions of years though, not days.

 

[Starman3000m]

that doesn't answer how the animals that nuckle asked about got there.....


for many species, the trip would have been longer than their life span

Again, you are basing your observation by today's thoughts. According to the Holy Bible, men's aged were well into the 100's before they died of "old age".

The animals that nucklesack asked about were all created by God and directed by God to safety.

If a person does not believe in God then I understand why they cannot comprehend "Intelligent Design" through the ability of a Divine Supreme Creator.

 

[tommyjones]

Hi tommy,

I live in Texas. This whole area was once underwater and we find various fossils of marine species buried in the limestone deposits. Lots of petrified wood and dinosaur skeletal remains are uncovered quite often. As you know, fossils of marine animals and dinosaurs are found throughout the continental U.S. as well as other parts of the earth, proving that those areas were all once underwater.

while there may be marine fossils in places that are dry now, that doesn't prove a world wide flood happened. only that the area was once under water- millions of years ago. at least thats what science says about the fossils.


so were there dinosaurs on the ark? I mean their bones were found in the same areas as those of marine animals. they must have been alive at the time of the flood....

 

[tommyjones]

Again, you are basing your observation by today's thoughts. According to the Holy Bible, men's aged were well into the 100's before they died of "old age".

The animals that nucklesack asked about were all created by God and directed by God to safety.

If a person does not believe in God then I understand why they cannot comprehend "Intelligent Design" through the ability of a Divine Supreme Creator.

right, the problem with your directed to safety stance is that even if we say animals lived 10 times longer than they do now, the animals at the far reaches of the earth would not have had enough time to travel under their own power to the ark in their lifetimes......

 

[theArtistFormerlyKnownAs]

Again, you are basing your observation by today's thoughts. According to the Holy Bible, men's aged were well into the 100's before they died of "old age".

The animals that nucklesack asked about were all created by God and directed by God to safety.

If a person does not believe in God then I understand why they cannot comprehend "Intelligent Design" through the ability of a Divine Supreme Creator.

and here I thought that people died EARLIER in life back then than now, due to the lack of scientific/medical advancement and such, but that must be crazy too because a book said people lived to be hundreds of years old (wasn't abraham like 1000+ by the time he finally died? I forget what the bible says about him )

 

[Starman3000m]

while there may be marine fossils in places that are dry now, that doesn't prove a world wide flood happened. only that the area was once under water- millions of years ago. at least thats what science says about the fossils.

Secular science is ever coming up with new discoveries whereby scientists and theorists have to make changes and rewrite textbooks.

so were there dinosaurs on the ark? I mean their bones were found in the same areas as those of marine animals. they must have been alive at the time of the flood....

Of course dinosaurs existed and would have been alive at the time of the Great Flood. Whether they were on the ark at the time is a question of subjective nature. The Bible speaks of "giants" that lived on the earth during the pre-delluvian period and states that God selected the animals that would board the ark. It was mentioned earlier that all animals on the ark did not necessarily have to be "fully grown". Who knows - maybe the dinosaurs provided great steaks and bone soup for the subsequent people who re-populated the earth after the Great Flood! Since there may not have been a "preservation society" during that time, the dino's became extinct - just like animals today can become extinct through the hunters and commercial businessmen who use the skins for selling to product manufacturers.

Also, it is believed that much of today's "fossil fuels" are derived from a massive concentration of animals and vegetation that have been buried under earth. Through ideal conditions, rotting and breaking down of matter will liquify and/or harden into fossil fuels. That's what science agrees upon.

 

[TimAllen]

and here I thought that people died EARLIER in life back then than now, due to the lack of scientific/medical advancement and such, but that must be crazy too because a book said people lived to be hundreds of years old (wasn't abraham like 1000+ by the time he finally died? I forget what the bible says about him )

You are thinking of Methuselah who lived to be 969 years old.

 

[This_person]

TP has been arguing from more of a - dare I say - liberal biblical interpretation.

I don't ask for people to accept my possibilities as actual answers to the questions (especially not the test tube babies one). I'm merely suggesting that there is more than one way to look at things - without needing to change what's written - and see the possibilities.

Just because popular lore teaches Noah marching animals to the ark two by two, that's not really what the story says. My goal is to get people (obviously not Johnny, since he claims to be uninterested in actually learning the answers to his questions) to read the stories themselves, and realize popular lore is not accurate with many things of the Bible. If you (they) read it themselves, I think they'll be more convinced of it's accuracy.

 

[TimAllen]

while there may be marine fossils in places that are dry now, that doesn't prove a world wide flood happened. only that the area was once under water- millions of years ago. at least thats what science says about the fossils.


so were there dinosaurs on the ark? I mean their bones were found in the same areas as those of marine animals. they must have been alive at the time of the flood....

There is no millions of years ago, The earth as we know it, and man has only been around for about 6000 years.

Do you believe in The Big Bang Theory Tommy?

 

[This_person]

and here I thought that people died EARLIER in life back then than now, due to the lack of scientific/medical advancement and such, but that must be crazy too because a book said people lived to be hundreds of years old (wasn't abraham like 1000+ by the time he finally died? I forget what the bible says about him )

This is actually a good point to bring up. In the first few chapters of Genesis, Adam is described as living around 930 years. After many more humans are around, God says He's going to limit our lifespans to 120 years. But, that didn't change people's lifespans immediately. We don't all live exactly 120 years - no more no less. This illustrates that God works over time - not "I dream of Jeanie" blink of an eye kind of thing. Could He? I imagine so, but why would He?

This just demonstrates that many of the scientific beliefs about things, and religious beliefs about things, as they relate to timing, could easily be compatible. Science could easily be proving over and over again the claims made thousands of years ago by religions.

 

[tommyjones]

Secular science is ever coming up with new discoveries whereby scientists and theorists have to make changes and rewrite textbooks.


Of course dinosaurs existed and would have been alive at the time of the Great Flood. Whether they were on the ark at the time is a question of subjective nature. The Bible speaks of "giants" that lived on the earth during the pre-delluvian period and states that God selected the animals that would board the ark. It was mentioned earlier that all animals on the ark did not necessarily have to be "fully grown". Who knows - maybe the dinosaurs provided great steaks and bone soup for the subsequent people who re-populated the earth after the Great Flood! Since there may not have been a "preservation society" during that time, the dino's became extinct - just like animals today can become extinct through the hunters and commercial businessmen who use the skins for selling to product manufacturers.

Also, it is believed that much of today's "fossil fuels" are derived from a massive concentration of animals and vegetation that have been buried under earth. Through ideal conditions, rotting and breaking down of matter will liquify and/or harden into fossil fuels. That's what science agrees upon.

do you know how long scientist believe it takes for that change to happen?

hint: its a lot longer than 6000 years.


so now you are saying that god might have let some of the animals die in the flood, therefore noah did not take 2 of each animal species on the boat?

 

[theArtistFormerlyKnownAs]

I don't ask for people to accept my possibilities as actual answers to the questions (especially not the test tube babies one). I'm merely suggesting that there is more than one way to look at things - without needing to change what's written - and see the possibilities.

Just because popular lore teaches Noah marching animals to the ark two by two, that's not really what the story says. My goal is to get people (obviously not Johnny, since he claims to be uninterested in actually learning the answers to his questions) to read the stories themselves, and realize popular lore is not accurate with many things of the Bible. If you (they) read it themselves, I think they'll be more convinced of it's accuracy.

I never said that :shrug:

There is no millions of years ago, The earth as we know it, and man has only been around for about 6000 years.

Do you believe in The Big Bang Theory Tommy?

wow, you just lost any little respect I still had for you...

I can't believe you are honestly trying to say that the earth has been around ONLY as long as man has....and for only 6k years at that

 

[This_person]

I never said that :shrug:

You really did. You said:

I didn't read your links because the one was bible gateway...which I recall as being an online bible or something which doesn't interest me right now, I was seeking opinions from the die-hard members here...

You're asking a Bible question, yet say you are not interested in looking in the Bible for the answers - you are looking for people's opinions.

Then, when someone offers an opinion different from yours, you berate them. When someone offers an opinion that agrees with yours, you them.

You're clearly not interested in learning the answers to your question(s), you're interested in picking fights.

 

[theArtistFormerlyKnownAs]

You really did. You said:You're asking a Bible question, yet say you are not interested in looking in the Bible for the answers - you are looking for people's opinions.

Then, when someone offers an opinion different from yours, you berate them. When someone offers an opinion that agrees with yours, you them.

You're clearly not interested in learning the answers to your question(s), you're interested in picking fights.

I've read the bible...multiple times...I went to Catholic school for nine years...been there done that

I berate someone if their opinion has no logical support :shrug:

I would love to learn the answers to the questions I asked, but nobody can really give them. The answer is either going to be "it is possible because God said it happened" or "It isn't logically/physically possible". There really hasn't been much wiggle room besides the few people, like yourself, that at least realize that these stories cannot be taken literally :shrug:

 

[This_person]

I would love to learn the answers to the questions I asked, but nobody can really give them.

You feel no one can give you an answer other than what you already believe, because you will only accept what you already believe. Any attempt to give you a different answer falls into the category of illogical to you. Your mind is closed.

There really hasn't been much wiggle room besides the few people, like yourself, that at least realize that these stories cannot be taken literally :shrug:

I think it's easy to take literally. Every animal that Noah knew of (why ask him to take animals of which he was unaware) was loaded on a boat. Every human besides those in his family were drown in a massive - world wide in the world known to Noah - flood. It's quite literally true, as written.

 

[foodcritic]

It was a big boat

Noah's Ark.



The thought of it just crossed my mind and I wanted the religious explanation of how he fit all of those animals on the boat, ect ect please.

TIA

Not only was it a big boat depending how you measure a cubit that's 450 feet long, 75 feet wide, and 45 feet high!

Also the animals that were brought in were by kind and were probably the smallest versions that he could identify.

 

[theArtistFormerlyKnownAs]

You feel no one can give you an answer other than what you already believe, because you will only accept what you already believe. Any attempt to give you a different answer falls into the category of illogical to you. Your mind is closed.I think it's easy to take literally. Every animal that Noah knew of (why ask him to take animals of which he was unaware) was loaded on a boat. Every human besides those in his family were drown in a massive - world wide in the world known to Noah - flood. It's quite literally true, as written.

ok, now YOU are just trying to pass time because we have already agreed that the story is possibly true, as written. It is the concept that people are trying to force on it, comparing it to modern day standards, that doesn't work for me. By that, I mean the people who actually try to rationalize all of the animals of today being loaded onto the boat, or actually having the entire world as we know it today, flood.

My mind is definitely not closed. I never close my mind to a topic if I can be logically proven incorrect. By asking someone to logically explain the concept we're discussing, being compared to TODAY'S knowledge (not the knowledge of the time) there are actually people who tried to rationalize it, and obviously failed.


lets put it plain and simple in writing.

I agree that the story is believable, as written, when based on the knowledge they had in that time period (thousands of years ago).

I disagree that the story some people are trying to rationalize, of the ACTUAL entire world (earth) flooding and all of the animals being saved by a single man, is true. That story is by all means exaggerated.