For all of those in Southern Md that have no clue how to get through a crossover

MiddleGround

Well-Known Member
The whole "you're blocking line of sight argument" is bull
WRONG!!!

You can ask the 2 fatal accident victim's family members at 235 and South Patuxent Beach Road. Both accidents were because they didn't know how to properly navigate the median while doing a U-turn and, in one of the cases, the opposing vehicle was a large box truck. Couldn't see around them and got T-boned by a speeder. The other was a T-bone because the opposing vehicle was a huge 3500 series dually.

Just becasue you "have a feeling" or "think" something might happen does not justify what you do as correct.
 

Tech

Well-Known Member
WRONG!!!

You can ask the 2 fatal accident victim's family members at 235 and South Patuxent Beach Road. Both accidents were because they didn't know how to properly navigate the median while doing a U-turn and, in one of the cases, the opposing vehicle was a large box truck. Couldn't see around them and got T-boned by a speeder. The other was a T-bone because the opposing vehicle was a huge 3500 series dually.

Just becasue you "have a feeling" or "think" something might happen does not justify what you do as correct.
The two roads you stated do not intersect.
If you meant Patuxent Beach Rd. that is a controlled intersection.
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
WRONG!!!

You can ask the 2 fatal accident victim's family members at 235 and South Patuxent Beach Road. Both accidents were because they didn't know how to properly navigate the median while doing a U-turn and, in one of the cases, the opposing vehicle was a large box truck. Couldn't see around them and got T-boned by a speeder. The other was a T-bone because the opposing vehicle was a huge 3500 series dually.

Just becasue you "have a feeling" or "think" something might happen does not justify what you do as correct.
It's not based "on a feeling". It is EXACTLY the way all intersections work at ones where there are LIGHTS.

Try turning on 4 and 235, or at Aldi's near Wildewood. Or any intersection where there are two directions of people turning at
the light, at the same time. They do not "cross" each other. They work exactly this way. True, there aren't accidents when those
lights are "turn signal only" but they work precisely that way when the light is merely green for everyone.

I turn at the Elk's club going southbound on Chancellor's Run all the time - and there almost always is someone turning in the opposite
lane. It's a light. We do not "cross" as supposedly the "correct" way is, but they do obscure people in the next lane -
but that's the way it is. You have to be careful, but if you try to do it the "right" way, and there are other cars in line,
you will absolutely have an incident, because I don't think the sharpest traffic cop could unclog that kind of mess.

For this reason - they actually paint LINES ON THE ROAD, showing people where to be. And amazingly - it's the
"wrong" way.
 

Tech

Well-Known Member
It's not based "on a feeling". It is EXACTLY the way all intersections work at ones where there are LIGHTS.

Try turning on 4 and 235, or at Aldi's near Wildewood. Or any intersection where there are two directions of people turning at
the light, at the same time. They do not "cross" each other. They work exactly this way. True, there aren't accidents when those
lights are "turn signal only" but they work precisely that way when the light is merely green for everyone.

I turn at the Elk's club going southbound on Chancellor's Run all the time - and there almost always is someone turning in the opposite
lane. It's a light. We do not "cross" as supposedly the "correct" way is, but they do obscure people in the next lane -
but that's the way it is. You have to be careful, but if you try to do it the "right" way, and there are other cars in line,
you will absolutely have an incident, because I don't think the sharpest traffic cop could unclog that kind of mess.

For this reason - they actually paint LINES ON THE ROAD, showing people where to be. And amazingly - it's the
"wrong" way.
And in crossovers that are deep enough to do it "correctly" they've painted a yellow line down the middle.
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
And in crossovers that are deep enough to do it "correctly" they've painted a yellow line down the middle.
I can't even begin to figure out how that would work.

And as was pointed out, the "right" way doesn't obscure the line of sight ONLY when there's only one car
going each way. If there's even ONE more car in line and you're doing it the "right" way - the second car in
line is STILL blocking your line of sight - if he isn't being a douche and pulling in front of you, blocking your
path. Something that cannot happen doing it the "wrong" way.
 

gemma_rae

Well-Known Member
Make a right turn, drive 100 feet and make a three point U-turn, then come back and make a left.

Oh, and make sure you're on your cellphone while you do it.
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
Actually something that DOES kind of piss me off, but - I also anticipate that people will do it anyway ---

Drive down the center lane in a parking lot, especially when the lane is easily wide enough to two opposing lanes.
Almost ANY TIME I am in a parking lot and turn into one of the lanes, there is someone driving right at me in the
middle of the lane. Hopefully, no one is walking to my right, because I usually have to swerve over quickly, because
the douche doing it almost never pulls back over.

For some people, they don't care. I used to have a roommate who routinely walked right down the middle of a lane
in the parking lot - only moving out of the way once he became AWARE there was a car about to hit him. Otherwise -
blissfully ignorant, walking down the middle.
 

MiddleGround

Well-Known Member
It's not based "on a feeling". It is EXACTLY the way all intersections work at ones where there are LIGHTS.
My apologies. I thought your response was with regards to the topic in the OP regarding median crossovers. I did not know that you changed the subject matter.
 

Goldenhawk

Well-Known Member
... in one of the cases, the opposing vehicle was a large box truck. Couldn't see around them and got T-boned by a speeder. The other was a T-bone because the opposing vehicle was a huge 3500 series dually.
In both of those cases, the person who got hit failed to ensure that the pathway would be clear before they proceeded. The fact that their line of sight was obstructed does not place the fault on the obstructing vehicle, but rather on their own failure to yield to oncoming traffic.

Yes, it sucks when you can't see around someone. Heck, it bugs me that every time I get to the Willows/Great Mills Road intersection coming out from the base, I can't see around vehicles in the opposing turn lane. However, I'm NOT allowed to simply gun it and hope for the best. I have to creep out and look carefully until I can see, before proceeding.
 

gemma_rae

Well-Known Member
So this is a case where 3 rights make a left? Or is it 3 rights make a wrong ?
Yes Sir! Defensive driving taught by Bell Atlantic in Washington D.C. Drive to the intersection past where you want to turn left, make three rights and go straight. Three rights make a left!

That's no BS either.
(it's proprietary information though, so keep a hat on it)
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
My apologies. I thought your response was with regards to the topic in the OP regarding median crossovers. I did not know that you changed the subject matter.
That is gracious of you - but I did not. Perhaps I was not articulate enough. My bad.

IN the OP - in that diagram - if you are at an intersection where there is a LIGHT - you will absolutely see
lines, if any, painted exactly the "wrong" way instructing motorists to drive that way. A typical one that
I go through all the time is the one at Aldi's, going south on 235. Those turn lanes do not cross over each
other. The lines painted on the road instruct you to do it "wrong".

Moreover, in the OP pic - if there is a second person in line behind the first - the view is still obstructed.
You gain nothing by doing it the "right" way. It only works if there are only two or fewer cars. Worse, if the
second driver chooses to creep ahead behind the first one on his side - he's going to BLOCK your path through
the intersection. And that is typically what I experience.

Doing it the "wrong" way still means, an obstructed view -but it is usually that way most of the time, unless there's
ONLY two cars. But it makes it impossible to create the logjam I described.
 
IN the OP - in that diagram - if you are at an intersection where there is a LIGHT - you will absolutely see
lines, if any, painted exactly the "wrong" way instructing motorists to drive that way. A typical one that
I go through all the time is the one at Aldi's, going south on 235. Those turn lanes do not cross over each
other. The lines painted on the road instruct you to do it "wrong".
And this goes back to an earlier post that said drivers are "pre-conditioned" to follow this pattern, and so in the initial OP diagram, you are pre-conditioned to enter the intersection the "wrong" way. Doing it the "right" way in not intuitive.
 

Tech

Well-Known Member
Actually something that DOES kind of piss me off, but - I also anticipate that people will do it anyway ---

Drive down the center lane in a parking lot, especially when the lane is easily wide enough to two opposing lanes.
Almost ANY TIME I am in a parking lot and turn into one of the lanes, there is someone driving right at me in the
middle of the lane. Hopefully, no one is walking to my right, because I usually have to swerve over quickly, because
the douche doing it almost never pulls back over.

For some people, they don't care. I used to have a roommate who routinely walked right down the middle of a lane
in the parking lot - only moving out of the way once he became AWARE there was a car about to hit him. Otherwise -
blissfully ignorant, walking down the middle.
I drive down the middle, walk down the side.
Driving down the middle gives me more time to react when the morons just back out of the space, the same goes for those rugrats that get away from the parents and dart out. But as near the intersections I do pull over, just in case you're coming. 😁
 

Tech

Well-Known Member
I can't even begin to figure out how that would work.

And as was pointed out, the "right" way doesn't obscure the line of sight ONLY when there's only one car
going each way. If there's even ONE more car in line and you're doing it the "right" way - the second car in
line is STILL blocking your line of sight - if he isn't being a douche and pulling in front of you, blocking your
path. Something that cannot happen doing it the "wrong" way.
I was thinking about some of the crossovers in Mechanicsville.
 

PeoplesElbow

Well-Known Member
In both of those cases, the person who got hit failed to ensure that the pathway would be clear before they proceeded. The fact that their line of sight was obstructed does not place the fault on the obstructing vehicle, but rather on their own failure to yield to oncoming traffic.

Yes, it sucks when you can't see around someone. Heck, it bugs me that every time I get to the Willows/Great Mills Road intersection coming out from the base, I can't see around vehicles in the opposing turn lane. However, I'm NOT allowed to simply gun it and hope for the best. I have to creep out and look carefully until I can see, before proceeding.
Those "Stenny bricks" really screwed up that intersection didn't they. Also made sure half the people wanting to make U-Turn can't actually turn in the radius that is there.
 
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