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Pixelated
The bible is a book. It doesn't assume anything; it's words just ARE.
Forgiven
- Thread starter newnature
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The bible is a book. It doesn't assume anything; it's words just ARE.
TheLibertonian
New Member
We're still in 10,000 BC bird dog. We just wear better clothing.
So, your Jewish and still believe The Messiah is on his way. I thought you were an Atheist. Glad you believe in something.
PsyOps
Pixelated
If you're referring to men wearing dresses... not in some countries.
TheLibertonian
New Member
No. I believe we are at our core violent and brutish by evolutionary necessity, because without it we would never have survived.
We haven't physically evolved for I think 50,000 years or so? So my brain, while stuffed full of knowledge, is the same brain of a man 50,000 years ago.
PsyOps
Pixelated
Then how has the Koala survived?
TheLibertonian
New Member
Lack of natural predators? Kind of like the panda.
ANd i'm not just talking about surviving, we've thrived because of our competitive nature and brutality. We channeled those natural killing urges and have created all sortso f things that have nothing to do with survival, like Tomaton, the robot that feeds you Tomatoes as you run.
PsyOps
Pixelated
The panda is a very brutal and territorial animal.
Humans are the only 'animal' on this earth that recognize the concept of good and evil. Although we are the only 'animal' that wages war, the vast majority of humans exercise a very unique thing called a 'conscience'. We have morals that govern our behavior and regular this so-called 'urge to kill'. The vast majority of humans will go their entire lives without every killing or even harming another human. This can't be said for the rest of the animal kingdom.
TheLibertonian
New Member
Right, but from a physical evolutionary standpoint that's no reason for that. Our brain hasn't changed that much.
That right there in itself is amazing, that we've come up with concepts that have nothing to do with the physical world. Justice, morality, ethics, legality.
PsyOps
Pixelated
The evidence isn’t in your saying so; the evidence is in our behavior; and even deeper – in our own thoughts. Do you have daily thoughts of wanting to kill someone? I would guess the answer is ‘absolutely not’. And why is that? Because you have a conscience; that thing that causes you to understand the wrong of taking the life of another; that that person’s life is just as precious as yours.
I assume you left out Spirituality on purpose, because it had nothing to do with human behavior...........
PsyOps
Pixelated
Let's first get past the "natural killing urges" and into some form of understanding that humans have "evolved" out of that and into a more conformed 'society' in which we recognize LIFE as - at a minimum - precious. When Lib can get to a point of saying he doesn't have this 'natural urge' to kill; then we can move on to what drives the human moral compass.
TheLibertonian
New Member
Every single human being has the natural capacity of violence. Some more, some less. I er on the side of less, because I am big and strong and could do damage to someone if I were violent, and I think rationalism and words are the first option.
But everyone, every single human being, has the capacity for violence. And I find that beautiful. I find our capacity for good beautiful. I love humanity, for all it's ills, because of its ills, because they only emphasize how those who rise up rise so high.
I reject universal moralism because it robs mankind of that spark. It's like the ancient alien conspiracy theories who think all the amazing structures and beliefs of man have to be based on space aliens. No. it comes fromus. With the mere power of our combined wills we have built monuments and gods.
And unlike Proxima whatshisface, I think man needs faith. Not necessarily in the Christian God, but in something. Faith in humanity is a good start.
That came out somewhat poorly; I don't mean faith in the Christian god is not fine, it is, but it's not necessarily the only sort of faith.
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A figure of speech relates to the form in which the words are used. It consists in the fact that a word or words are used out of their ordinary sense, or place, or manner, for the purpose of attracting our attention to what is said.
In Genesis chapter three, we have neither allegory, myth, legend, nor fable, but literal historical facts set forth, and emphasized by the use of certain figures of speech. When Satan is spoken of as a ‘serpent’, it is the figure Hypocatastasis or Implication. An implied resemblance or representation.
Other figures of speech are used in Genesis 3:14-15, but only for the same purpose of emphasizing the truth and the reality of what is said. “Thou shalt bruise his heel”, it cannot mean his literal heel of flesh and blood, but suffering, more temporary in character.
“He shall crush thy head”, it means something more than a skull of bone, and brain, and hair. It means that all Satan’s plans and plots, policy and purposes, will one day be finally crushed and ended, never more to mar or to hinder the purposes of God.
This will be effected when Satan shall be bruised under our feet (Romans 16:20). This, again, will not be our literal feet, but something much more real. The bruising of Christ’s heel is the most eloquent and impressive way of foretelling the most solemn events; and to point out that the effort made by Satan to evade his doom, then threatened, would become the very means of insuring its accomplishment; for it was through the death of Christ that he who had the power of death would be destroyed; and all Satan’ power and policy brought to an end, and all his works destroyed. What literal words could portray these literal facts so wonderfully as these expressive figures of speech?
With the story of the stars, the Bible can assume the great usurper is the cause of that flood in Genesis 1:1.
PsyOps
Pixelated
There you have it…. You operate on governing things like “rationalism” and “words” rather than violence; yet you claim we haven’t moved beyond this capacity for violence. We have the ‘capacity’ to do a lot of things. One of those you seem to dismiss is the capacity to LOVE and do no harm to others. The capacity to love overrides any capacity to commit violence in the vast majority of humans. Therefore, you have conclude our minds are not innately (or centrally) violent.
And even when you call this a ‘natural’ thing – this capacity for violence – a beautiful thing; in that same breath you call it an ‘ill’. I find that pretty ironic.
I’m not suggesting there is a ‘universal moralism’. If there were, we’d all believe in one thing (whatever that thing might be). But, I do believe there is a universal governor in our minds that gives us the ability to distinguish between right and wrong, and removes that desire to do harm or commit abject violence. Having this capacity for violence does not override the larger capacity to not act out with violence.
If you believe there is this innate capacity for violence, what's the point in faith? If we can't resist this urge for violence having faith in 'humanity' is pointless.
TheLibertonian
New Member
You do know that "the great usurper" you keep referencing didn't get added into biblical narrative until much much later in the history of Christiandom right?
PsyOps
Pixelated
Explain.
The history of Genesis chapter three is intended to teach us the fact that Satan’s sphere of activities is in the religious sphere, and not the spheres of crime or immorality; that his battlefield is not the sins arising from human depravity, but the unbelief of the human heart. We are not to look for Satan’s activities today in the newspaper press, or the police courts; but in the pulpit, and in professors’ chairs. Whenever the Word of God is called in question, there we see the trail of that old serpent?
I just use the name usurper, because of what was done in the overall context of the Bible. Like I said, Genesis shouldn't have happen, but this usurper started it.
TheLibertonian
New Member
The modern idea of Satan mostly stems from Paradise Lost. Older belife about the devil and demons and witchcraft and such was much more varied.
PsyOps
Pixelated
You must be taking this from an atheistic or secular point of view. This is not even remotely a Christian concept of who Satan is.
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