One good thing about this thread. I learned there is a difference between telework and remote work.
Govt Work at Home May Be Over
- Thread starter Sneakers
- Start date
glhs837
Power with Control
Software perhaps. There's a whole other world out there. I don't see it on my level to much either, we get hardcore folks. But like PE says, on the lower end its endemic.
So - what you're saying is - you pay contractors to do the low-level bullsht type stuff?
Interesting. Our contractors are usually hired to do the super hard stuff NO ONE knows how to do.
I've known us to handle such things two ways - either pay an intern to do that - like a summer intern writing documentation or software testing - or hand it off to the most useless full timer that you can't seem to get rid of. So long as they don't view it as -punishment - they won't go run to the union and cry their hearts out.
glhs837
Power with Control
Not me. I'm a unicorn subject matter expert. And I got hired because I have a unique knowledge base. I don't pay anyone to do anything. But there's a whole world of administrative and support level functions that have to happen for navair and other government folks to operate. When you call the nmci help desk who do you think answers the phone? Administrative assistants out of in front of captains and ses'rs offices. Who do you think those people are? The guy running the mail room in the bottom of the building? All contractors.
I am guessing nmci is your internet? I don't and never have worked at PAX.
glhs837
Power with Control
Mine and everyone else who works for the Navy or Marine Corps worldwide. Which was my point. That world of govt support contractors has a huge scope from unique folks pampered like show ponies down to $16 an hour help desk agents. Or folks running tool rooms in test squadrons. Hell. Quite a lot of aircraft maintenance on Pax River is done by contractors.
I know software development can be pretty insulated from stuff. Heck even development labs can be. But the world is pretty big
Gotcha. I've been in this area over thirty years - it's always assumed by people when they hear I'm a programmer, that I work on base. I wish I had a nickel for every time a function is held on base, and I have to explain for the millionth time that I need some kind of pass. OR that all government work is military.
It's a strange idea to me to contract out menial jobs, since in so many parts of where I have worked, there's always a nitwit being paid a government salary who is too useless to be tasked with anything challenging. AND the opposite, where we can't afford to hire a super egghead full time, but it's cost effective to contract him out.
glhs837
Power with Control
I work quite a lot with folks whose work sites are offsite. The reason it makes sense is that the turnover for a lot of these jobs is so high that the govt onboarding process might not even be done by the time they bailed. Help desk jobs, Tier One anyway, those would be what, GS5 or GS6? And little to no upward mobility. Same for front desk guards. mail Room, tool room, etcetera.
glhs837
Power with Control
I don't know, everything we do has to be approved by the Contracting Officer. Direct support contracts are a whole different game than vendor contracts.
PeoplesElbow
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't quite say bullshit type stuff, they start out somewhere around $30/hr and are so in demand we fired one (his dad wasn't in the management chain) and he had a job next door making $10/hr more within a couple weeks, for the same company no less.
22AcaciaAve
Well-Known Member
I don't how that's possible. I know in the private sector there is no way you can expense those things back to your employer. Those are called the price you pay for the privilege of working from home. I can't imagine you can do that in the government either.
Now you can use those as expenses on your income tax, but I thought that was only if you are running a business or are self employed and file a schedule C. My wife owned her own business and was self employed for over a decade. I did the taxes and it was a pain. In order to write off things like your heat, telephone, and supplies like toilet paper you had to have a dedicated office at home and there was a formula for figuring out the percentage of space it occupied and applying that. You could even write off mileage on your car when used for business. You could also buy a car and title it to the business and make it a business expense. Of course that also subjects it to personal property tax. And it is all a big red flag to the IRS when it comes to audits. She gave the business up and went back into the working world quite some time ago. As the tax preparer in the family I was never happier.
22AcaciaAve
Well-Known Member
The bottom line on the government return to the office is that it is simply a ploy to get people to quit, or those who can, retire. Couple that with a hiring freeze and you can immediately trim a percentage off of the federal work force and claim a win. That's the spastic first buddy's goal. He used the same methodology when he bought twitter. And it will work to a degree, but I don't know if it will be as successful as he thinks it will be. Some will retire, some will leave to find other places that are more telework friendly, but government benefits are good and I don't know if I see that many people giving them up. Especially not people that are 10-15 years in. They are building on a pension and a lot of private sector places are moving away from a traditional pension for 401K matching and things like that. I think government still offers a monthly until you die pension and it is based on your salary and years of service. That's hard to find in today's workplace.
In all my years of working I've found that good workers get their work done no matter where they are and slackers will slack whether at home or in the office. It's all a matter of holding people accountable. Requiring a work force to be in the office 5 days a week is as old fashioned as getting your news from a little blue box on the street that dispenses a newspaper.
In all my years of working I've found that good workers get their work done no matter where they are and slackers will slack whether at home or in the office. It's all a matter of holding people accountable. Requiring a work force to be in the office 5 days a week is as old fashioned as getting your news from a little blue box on the street that dispenses a newspaper.
glhs837
Power with Control
Civil Service Retirement System (CSRS) vs. Federal Employees Retirement System (FERS) - Federal Employment Law Firm of Aaron D Wersing PLLC
We commonly get asked, CSRS vs. FERS: Which is better? Here are the essential characteristics of both systems. Still have questions? Call today!
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For anyone that entered after 84. That traditional pension bit is a small part. The Thrift Savings Plan, a simplified 401K is most of it.
Bare-ya-cuda
Well-Known Member
Can’t stay away can you?
Clem72
Well-Known Member
If the admin assistant is indeed out front of the office they might be contractor. If they are sitting with 10 other admins for a four hour lunch in the in the mess hall they are gov't.
Is she hot?
Clem72
Well-Known Member
Why is that a strange idea? It's cost effective to hire out the menial jobs because their employers don't have to give them 11 holidays, 5 weeks of leave, 2.5 weeks of sick, a pension, and 401k matching so they can make a profit while still charging the government less than the cost of a civil servant.
The government pays much more to employ those workers directly.
On the other hand It is typically not cost effective to hire out knowledge workers / skilled labor / white collar jobs because employers provide most all those same benefits (sans the pension, but usually much higher 401k match) and pay 30-50% more in salary and also need to make a profit. The government doesn't want to pay competitive wages for this type of work, but obviously it still needs to be done. Of course it doesn't hurt that so many of our politicians and top brass are invested in these contract companies so we will likely never see the situation remedied.
And yes, we have heard you say a million times you don't work at Pax. Guess what? We don't care. There's like 10k+ employees at Pax in a metro area of like 100k people. That's 1 in 10 works on the base, so if you say you're a government employee that lives in the area of course it's going to be assumed you work on base. Just get over it. You're the guy that lives in the West Virginia Coal town, works for the company that owns the mine that supports the entire town, and then gets upset when people assume you work in the mine.
PeoplesElbow
Well-Known Member
yea
PeoplesElbow
Well-Known Member
Not sure I'd say that, mine is going to be about $5500/moCivil Service Retirement System (CSRS) vs. Federal Employees Retirement System (FERS) - Federal Employment Law Firm of Aaron D Wersing PLLC
We commonly get asked, CSRS vs. FERS: Which is better? Here are the essential characteristics of both systems. Still have questions? Call today!
For anyone that entered after 84. That traditional pension bit is a small part. The Thrift Savings Plan, a simplified 401K is most of it.
22AcaciaAve
Well-Known Member
Yeah I knew that the government pension plans changed sometime in the 80's. Isn't it also true that people in the old CSRS system were not eligible for SS and that changed with the FERS pension system?Civil Service Retirement System (CSRS) vs. Federal Employees Retirement System (FERS) - Federal Employment Law Firm of Aaron D Wersing PLLC
We commonly get asked, CSRS vs. FERS: Which is better? Here are the essential characteristics of both systems. Still have questions? Call today!
For anyone that entered after 84. That traditional pension bit is a small part. The Thrift Savings Plan, a simplified 401K is most of it.
You could be right about the pension being a small part. But still it is something. Private sector pensions have gone through a lot of changes as well. The government FERS still gives you a monthly payment in addition to SS. Most private sector jobs don't have that anymore. Those that do still provide pensions are mostly lump sum pensions. I think a bigger enticement is health care for life which the gov pays at 72% once you are vested after 5 years. I think you have to be in that plan for 5 years when you retire. Not sure if that is the same if you work for the gov and leave for another job.