I find the Noah's Ark story creepy

[Dymphna]

Originally posted by Tonio
I believe that conflicts with the concept of a loving God, at least the one portrayed in the New Testament.

Not the only conflict between the New and Old Testament. Maybe God took an Anger Management course :shrug:

 

[ceo_pte]

Originally posted by darkriver4362
Which version of the bible do you have pte?? My mom has 2 right here and I can't find it in either, it's not there either.

Hmm... it's in the KJV and NIV.

 

[darkriver4362]

Originally posted by ceo_pte
Hmm... it's in the KJV and NIV.

J/w and not trying to be mean...what is NIV? The Catholic one here doesn't have it and some other unnamed version doesn't have it.

 

[Kain99]

[2] and no plant of the field had yet sprung up, for the LORD God had not sent rain on the earth [3] and there was no man to work the ground, 6 but streams [4] came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground- 7 the LORD God formed the man [5] from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.

Read the text still don't think it holds water! (Dayum I'm funny) Anyway this is referencing Eden before Man was even brought on the scene. But I do apologize for thinking that you are a complete idiot.

 

[Kain99]

Originally posted by darkriver4362
J/w and not trying to be mean...what is NIV? The Catholic one here doesn't have it and some other unnamed version doesn't have it.

New International Version... Takes all the big words out and makes the book easier to read.

 

[darkriver4362]

Hold up.....there are so many versions of the bible.....how are we going to know which is right and which one is wrong???

 

[darkriver4362]

Oh ok.....I see.....

 

[ceo_pte]

Originally posted by cmcdanal
Not the only conflict between the New and Old Testament. Maybe God took an Anger Management course :shrug:

I've read the Bible and see God as a loving God (sending Jesus to die on the cross), but I also see where he says that people will be judged. It also says in the Bible which things anger him.

I use to be the same way. The Bible all seemed too hard to believe. It just seemed easier to believe something that the world suggested, b/c they appeared to have proof. But as I read more and started my own investigating, I started seeing the Bible as the truth. I don't intend to push my beliefs on other people, but I do stand firmly on what I believe. I agree with CMC too. Too many people judge God, by the actions of man. For example, if they see a Christian doing something wrong they immediately condemn God and base their belief in God and his word on the actions of man. NO man/woman is perfect and will continue to make mistakes, but that has no reflection on God and his word.

 

[Ehesef]

Originally posted by Kain99
Read the text still don't think it holds water! (Dayum I'm funny) Anyway this is referencing Eden before Man was even brought on the scene. But I do apologize for thinking that you are a complete idiot.

That's how I read it too. All it's saying is that it had never rained up to the point where Adam and Eve were created. It doesn't say anything in relation to the story of Noah. Wouldn't you think that Noah would ask what rain was if he had never seen it before?

 

[Club'nBabySeals]

The main problem I have with geologist and most of their assumptions is there way of dating items. Carbon dating is based on someones assumptions. The foundation for determining how old something is was arbitrarily picked. I do believe dinosaurs existed, but I don't think the Earth is no more than about 6000 years old.

I suppose I should validate the substance behind what I am about to say by getting it out into the open that I am, in fact, an archaeologist with a focus on the Middle Eastern world. I've worked in Morocco, Turkey, and Rome---and I daresay that although my studies were mainly focused upon Assyrian civilization, I am rather well versed in most other related subjects.

That said, I would like to take a moment to explain the effectivity of Carbon 14 dating. I'm not going to talk about the molecular principles, but if anyone is interested I can recommend some reading that might elaborate on the subject.


1. No, it is not COMPLETELY accurate; and the fewer the samples, the higher the error rating is likely to be, but as a rule Carbon 14 dating has proven in test scenarios of known dates that it typically gets within 50-100 years. Pretty big gap, I know, but this technique becomes much more accurate when the average of a number of related samples is calculated.

2. Samples can be contaminated! This can happen when a person picks up a piece of charcoal with his bare hands---that carbon sample would then potentially contain skin cells from that person, and thus the reading would be horribly inaccurate. This is also why numerous samples are preferable.

3. In addition to surmising a date by calculating the half life of a molecule of carbon (which, if you can believe that the basic 4 functions of math are absolute science, should be enough to tell you that this process is--in cases where the samlpes are good--almost fool proof), archaeologists often elicit other means of dating such as dendrochronology (tree rings), diagnostic piece dating (Taking a known factor and comparing it--such as looking at a pottery shard and noting that the pattern is extremely similar to a piece of pottery that we KNOW is from 18th century France), and a veritable wealth of other sources. The combined findings from these methods can often narrow a date to within 5 years.





And Pete......with all due respect, there are living TREES located in the American SouthWest that are over 6000 years old. I can understand your skepticism about date ranges within reason, but modern human (Homo Sapien) history alone dates back 18,000 years.



I also have some information on the "Epic Flood" theories. I'll post those after lunch.

 

[darkriver4362]

Originally posted by ceo_pte
I've read the Bible and see God as a loving God (sending Jesus to die on the cross), but I also see where he says that people will be judged. It also says in the Bible which things anger him.

I use to be the same way. The Bible all seemed too hard to believe. It just seemed easier to believe something that the world suggested, b/c they appeared to have proof. But as I read more and started my own investigating, I started seeing the Bible as the truth. I don't intend to push my beliefs on other people, but I do stand firmly on what I believe. I agree with CMC too. Too many people judge God, by the actions of man. For example, if they see a Christian doing something wrong they immediately condemn God and base their belief in God and his word on the actions of man. NO man/woman is perfect and will continue to make mistakes, but that has no reflection on God and his word.

I have read the bible and had to go thru (forcefully) a religious school till 6th grade. We had to memorize parts and BELEIVE it no matter what...no questions...On that, about 2 years ago my buddy from Saudi Arabia sent me a copy of the Qu'ran....read that...you might be suprised at the actual eliquancy(sp) of the wording, and direct scientific facts that are included in it. JMO

 

[Kain99]

Originally posted by ceo_pte
Too many people judge God, by the actions of man. For example, if they see a Christian doing something wrong they immediately condemn God and base their belief in God and his word on the actions of man.

Ceo

Can I be really super honest for one second? This is the very reason I take exception with you. It is your job to represent God on earth. You have appointed yourself one of his soldiers which is great! Bad part is you spew misinformation and judgement causing those who are not close to God to view Christians as whack jobs! You can't change the way that "people" are but you can change the way that you are. Just a piece of advice. If you turn one away with your rantings you will be held accountable.

Kwillia

I do believe you are right! It was all them mass orgies that brought the whole darn thing on in the first place!

 

[darkriver4362]

Clubbin', thanks for the info, I think 50-100 years is pretty accurate when you are talking about something that is 10,000-1,000,000 years old.

 

[ceo_pte]

Originally posted by Kain99
Read the text still don't think it holds water! (Dayum I'm funny) Anyway this is referencing Eden before Man was even brought on the scene. But I do apologize for thinking that you are a complete idiot.

That's cool, eveyone has their own opinions. It's nice to see someone ask for the evidence, read the evidence, and then put some personal reasoning behind it. Eventhough it doesn't hold water..

 

[ceo_pte]

Originally posted by Club'nBabySeals
I suppose I should validate the substance behind what I am about to say by getting it out into the open that I am, in fact, an archaeologist with a focus on the Middle Eastern world. I've worked in Morocco, Turkey, and Rome---and I daresay that although my studies were mainly focused upon Assyrian civilization, I am rather well versed in most other related subjects.

That said, I would like to take a moment to explain the effectivity of Carbon 14 dating. I'm not going to talk about the molecular principles, but if anyone is interested I can recommend some reading that might elaborate on the subject.


1. No, it is not COMPLETELY accurate; and the fewer the samples, the higher the error rating is likely to be, but as a rule Carbon 14 dating has proven in test scenarios of known dates that it typically gets within 50-100 years. Pretty big gap, I know, but this technique becomes much more accurate when the average of a number of related samples is calculated.

2. Samples can be contaminated! This can happen when a person picks up a piece of charcoal with his bare hands---that carbon sample would then potentially contain skin cells from that person, and thus the reading would be horribly inaccurate. This is also why numerous samples are preferable.

3. In addition to surmising a date by calculating the half life of a molecule of carbon (which, if you can believe that the basic 4 functions of math are absolute science, should be enough to tell you that this process is--in cases where the samlpes are good--almost fool proof), archaeologists often elicit other means of dating such as dendrochronology (tree rings), diagnostic piece dating (Taking a known factor and comparing it--such as looking at a pottery shard and noting that the pattern is extremely similar to a piece of pottery that we KNOW is from 18th century France), and a veritable wealth of other sources. The combined findings from these methods can often narrow a date to within 5 years.





And Pete......with all due respect, there are living TREES located in the American SouthWest that are over 6000 years old. I can understand your skepticism about date ranges within reason, but modern human (Homo Sapien) history alone dates back 18,000 years.



I also have some information on the "Epic Flood" theories. I'll post those after lunch.

Thanks for the information. I will have to do more research on what you said about Carbon 14 dating.

 

[blacklabman]

I think there was only one law (force) at the time of the Big Bang. The physics community continues to try to determine the nature of this force.

Newton's Laws may only be true in the world we know now.

 

[Tonio]

Originally posted by kwillia
Ya know... I did a search and while reading the blurbs it seems to me the whole 40 days/40 nights thing was basically a result of men sexing it up with multiple wimmons...

So if man was evil, why does Genesis have God also destory the innocent animals?

I find escathology creepy, because it implies that the end of the world is a good thing. There are some fundamentalists who are fervent supporters of Israel because they see that nation's existence as a precursor to Armageddon. Why would someone look forward longingly to no future and no existence? Punk bands used to be criticized for advocating a doomsday nihilism in their lyrics.

 

[Kain99]

Originally posted by Tonio
Why would someone look forward longingly to no future and no existence?

That's easy Tonio..... No more Bills to pay!

 

[ceo_pte]

Originally posted by Kain99
Ceo

Can I be really super honest for one second? This is the very reason I take exception with you. It is your job to represent God on earth. You have appointed yourself one of his soldiers which is great! Bad part is you spew misinformation and judgement causing those who are not close to God to view Christians as whack jobs! You can't change the way that "people" are but you can change the way that you are. Just a piece of advice. If you turn one away with your rantings you will be held accountable.

Kwillia

I do believe you are right! It was all them mass orgies that brought the whole darn thing on in the first place!

It's not my job it's my choice. I don't think I spew misinformation. After all was it not you who jumped down my throat saying "ah he must have taken it from his book." Then you see the words, straight from the Bible and you still have too much pride to admit you were wrong. C'mon. I'm not looking for an apology or approval from anyone. I never judge anyone. God handles that. You misinterpret my sharing of information as me judging someone. I don't twist the word, it says what it says. If you don't believe it that's ok. You are right about changing people though and I work everyday on myself and believe me, I have alot of work to do.

 

[Tonio]

Originally posted by Kain99
That's easy Tonio..... No more Bills to pay!

Now I have the Sex Pistols' God Save the Queen running through my head.