More Trent Lott stuff

Larry Gude

Strung Out
Gotcha!

I was interested in Texas when they tried that racket in place of flat out racial profiling but Texas' 10% sucks ### to! Think about it.

You're kid is 11% in one of the better and tougher schools in the state and you ain't got much money. Some dim bulb makes top 10% in a total POS school and he/she are in. Your kid goes to community college.

Admissions should be based on what you are trying to get admitted to. If kids in the POS school can't hack the requirements then, what to do?

1. Lower the admission standards to a school that can fill every spot it has with better-qualified kids?

2. Raise the standards at the crap school so the kids can succeed when they move up?

3. ???

I just find it horrifying that we want to send some kid though a system and continually lower the standards to get him through and them call it "success".

Consider yourself quibbled with! LOL
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
You guys made it clear that racisim has no part in your party
That's what I was hoping for. And yes, both parties have their fringe element but we're not supposed to put them in leadership positions.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Well, Dems, I don't know what you've become but I am what I always was - a person who believes in right and wrong, not political parties.
:angel:
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
And for those of you who didn't read the above link to the Krauthammer piece, I implore you to do it now.
There is a principle at stake here. Better to lose the Senate than to lose your soul. New elections come around every two years. Souls are scarcer.
:clap: Yeah buddy!
 

MGKrebs

endangered species
So if you don't agree with

affirmative action, you must believe that the playing field is now level, right? EVERYBODY has equal OPPORTUNITY?
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Originally posted by MGKrebs
you must believe that the playing field is now level, right? EVERYBODY has equal OPPORTUNITY?
Yes. I challenge you to show me a real example that proves the opposite.
 

demsformd

New Member
Well I won't say that there is equal opportunity in America, because well there most definitely is not. But we cannot say conclusively that there is either. African-Americans, hispanics, women, have all been discrimated against for centuries in not only this nation but in the world (and of course, the subjugation of women continues throughout the Middle East). Our way of making up for this past discrimination comes through the usage of Affirmative Action, which has truly leveled the field to a much greater extent. We cannot get rid of this at this point in our history because as Trent Lott showed us this week, racisim is still alive and well in America.
Granted, I feel that the program needs to be reformed so that true quotas do not occur. You know, alot of the people here would label Clinton as that liberal, but his position on this matter is in complete agreement with me..."mend it, but don't end it." When all things are equal, the minority or woman applicant for a job should be promoted. All these bonuses for promoting minorities without merit is truly contrary to Martin Luther King's view of what society should be. It needs reform, but the idea of the system needs to continue on.
 

MGKrebs

endangered species
http://www.drcnet.org/rapid/1997/12-5-1.html#alabama

A study conducted by the Birmingham Post-Herald newspaper shows that while blacks and whites charged with drug offenses stand an equal chance of being convicted in Alabama, black convicts are nearly twice as likely to receive jail time and nearly two and one half times as likely to receive prison terms of one year or more.

http://www.hrw.org/campaigns/geneva/item6.htm

...As a result, although blacks constitute an estimated fifteen percent of all drug users ...blacks constitute 36 percent of arrests for drug possession and half of all arrests for drug selling.

... in seven states, ... blacks eligible for life sentences as repeat drug offenders were 5 times more likely to receive a life sentence than life-eligible whites and received 98 percent of all such life sentences.

Although the prevalence of both crack and powder cocaine use is higher among whites than African Americans (more than half of all crack cocaine users are white), 96 percent of those prosecuted for crack possession and facing the higher crack sentences are black or Latino

http://www.cjpf.org/Drug/outcomes2.html

roughly 36% of those arrested for drugs offenses are African-American, and roughly 59% of those convicted of those drug offenses are African-American. And of those convicted, African-Americans go to prison more frequently and for longer terms.

Human Rights Watch compared the rate of African-Americans going to prison for drug offenses to the rate of whites going to prison for drug offenses. Nation-wide the Black rates was 13 times the white rate using 1996 data from 37 states. On average, 482 of every 100,000 black men sentenced to prison are sent there on drug charges, compared with just 36 of every 100,000 white men. "More blacks were sent to state prison nationwide on drug charges than for crimes of violence," Jamie Fellner, associate counsel for Human Rights Watch, wrote in the report. "Only 27 percent of black admissions to prison were for crimes of violence – compared to 38 percent for drug offenses."

In Illinois, the Black rate was 57 times the white rate. This disparity has resulted in African- Americans dominating the prison populations in many states. African Americans are 90 percent of those who were incarcerated for selling or using drugs in Illinois and Maryland. In New Jersey, and four states in the South --- Louisiana, North Carolina, South Carolina and Virginia --- blacks make up more than 80 percent of those in prison on drug convictions. The law enforcement focus on African-American drug suspects has resulted in 7 percent of all black people living in Texas and Oklahoma living behind bars.

... in 1998 there were 313,467 Black users of cocaine and 721,784 White users of cocaine over the age of 18 who used cocaine at least once in the past month (as measured in the 1998 Federal National Household Survey on Drug Abuse, released August 1999).

In October 1995, The Sentencing Project reported the now well-known statistic that one-in-three young black men is under correctional supervision or control (Marc Mauer and Tracy Huling, Young Black Americans and the Criminal Justice System: Five Years Later, The Sentencing Project, 1995).

It is less well known that the American rate of incarceration is five to ten times that of most European nations -- but most of that extraordinarily high rate is due to the profoundly greater rates of incarceration of African-Americans, particularly drug defendants. The rate of white incarceration in the U.S. is only about 1.5 to 2 times greater than that of most developed nations. Nationally, blacks are incarcerated at a rate 8.14 times that of whites

On December 31, 1995 the number of white prisoners in Federal and State correctional institutions was 455,021, while the number of black prisoners was 544,005. On the same day, the number of whites on parole were 339,938 and the number of blacks was 299,721

http://www.212.net/crime/justice.htm

According to a 1994 report from the American Bar Association's Criminal Justice section...

Blacks, who comprise only 12% of the population and 13% of drug users, constitute some 35% of those arrested for drug possession, 55% of those convicted of possession, and 74% of those sentenced to prison for possession.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
I won't deny that racism exists - this week's events has surely opened my eyes. Plus that, you see incidences in the news where some freak has killed someone else because of their ethnicity. But I don't think it's that wide-spread. And I also don't think you'll EVER get rid of it. There will ALWAYS be people who hate based on skin color, religion or some other arbitrary reason.

I think they should scrap racist programs like affirmative action and treat blacks like any other American citizen. You hear black activists go on TV saying, "I don't FEEL like an American." Well, duh! That's because you're not TREATED like an American. You're patronized with special preferences, education is dumbed down for you, California legislators consider making Ebonics a real language because they don't think you can even speak English, and to top it all off, they don't even CALL you an American - they call you an "African" American, very different from real Americans like us whiteys.

Yes, racism is alive and well. But there IS equal opportunity. How else do you explain the number of blacks who are in high corporate positions, who are college educated, who are top entertainers, who hold government positions? It's talent and ambition that determine whether someone will be successful or not.
 

demsformd

New Member
Good points, VRA, but I don't think that true equal opportunity has occurred. While there are blacks on the top corporate boards and whatever, their percentage of these jobs are much lower than their percentage in the American population. Like there is a group of 30 board of directors...with one black guy. There has to be more than one qualified black guy that could be on the board. But your sentiments are right, we do need to gradually phase Affirmative Action as long as we see that it does not jeopardize the position of minorities and women in the private sector.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Explain, then, how Asians manage to succeed and excel? There's even less of them in the US than blacks but you rarely hear about problems with them. I believe it's because they don't have other Asians telling them how hopeless everything is and that America "owes" them. Their entertainment heroes are Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan, not Snoop Dogg and Spike Lee. The best way to relieve the US of it's black stereotypes is to outlaw other blacks making derogatory movies and songs about them. And outlaw Jesse Jackson and Louis Farrakhan.

People like Farrakhan, Jackson, those ghetto rap guys, etc. are no better than the African slave catchers who sold their black countrymen into slavery. There's money to be made so to hell with anything else.
 

demsformd

New Member
Originally posted by vraiblonde
And outlaw Jesse Jackson and Louis Farrakhan.
Yeah, I wish that people would stop listening to these dumbasses. I ask that we all listen to Rep. John Lewis of Georgia, Elijah Cummings of Baltimore, and John Conyors of Michigan. These guys have much to offer to the black community unlike Farrakhan and Jackson...or and especially Sharpton.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Hold up there, good buddy. Conyers is a BIG reparation guy - it's just about all he talks about. If that's not opening wounds, I don't know what is.
 

demsformd

New Member
Yeah the minute I wrote that I started to recall that...so no go on him. Scratch Conyers, and insert a person that definitely shoulda been there Secretary of State Colin Powell.
 
K

Kain99

Guest
Crap Vrai... It's almost impossible to top your posts... Here's my opinion, You can only blame the white majority so much for the negro races situation. It's a mind set.... Are ya following me here?

This is a Race of people who often use the BIG NO NO (N) word to address one another.... Whats that all about? Watching movies it seems that the race prides it's self on the gangsta persona.....

Why? When I was small my aunt used to use a term that I still love today... "Excited Misery" Basically this means that one or more, turn to self righteous indignation or drama to acheive a goal when they know no other way out....
 

MGKrebs

endangered species
You guys seem to think

That everybody starts out with a clean slate. But if you grow up in a Catholic household, you will very likely remain a Catholic. Same with liberal, conservative, redneck, military, college, etc. The environment you are brought up in plays a large role in your attitude and career/life choices.

There are black kids growing up today in households with grandparents who were sharecroppers, whose parents were not allowed to vote or eat certain places or even go certain places. It would be nice to think that those parents and grandparents could forget that past and teach their kids that it is different now. But how do you forget being turned down over and over for a home loan for no apparent reason? How are they supposed to feel? And do we really want to forget that? If we do, aren't we in danger of repeating it?

These things take generations to change. Why are we so insistent that blacks make this huge cultural change in just 40 years, especially when many of the victims of the past are still alive?!!

I am a middle class white male. I have virtually no restrictions on any life path I choose. I do not regret the possibility, or even the fact, that I might have been passed over for some job or other opportunity in favor of a minority. I am certain I have many more opportunities to pursue than many of my fellow citizens, black, white, female, and I can go find something else.

Even women can't really expect to have the same opportunities as most men. The pay disparities are getting better, but are still shameful.

When you were growing up, did your parents tell you that you could be anything you wanted? Maybe even the President? Do you think black parents could have said that to their kids?

How about American Indians? Do we owe them anything for stealing their land and killing them for being in our way? I've been through the plains states, and a lot of the land we did give them for reservations is virtually useless. They have been plopped out in the middle of nowhere in mobile homes, on land that is suitable only for cattle grazing, but with no money or resources to take advantage of it. Even access to electricity is still spotty.

I understand your point about the cycle of dependancy, and yes, this is part of it. But as has been said, that doesn't mean we have to throw out everything we are doing. We are still working our way through finding what works and what doesn't. We are getting there, but we're not done.
 

MGKrebs

endangered species
A story

A black man I know well once told me that a big difference in the attitude between whites and blacks is this;

When he gets the incorrect change at a store, he often has a moment of wondering whether the clerk is screwing with him because he's black. Same with traffic problems, or any other situation where he is dependant on a white person for something. But he's not angry. It's just the way it is. Enough stuff happens that is overtly racist that blacks end up questioning everything.

Going through your life with this all day, everyday MUST affect one's attitude. We are human. Don't tell me racism is over. Don't tell me that the government doesn't have a responsibility to keep pushing for equality and fairness. Don't tell me that we are so greedy that we can't each give up a couple of bucks a year to support programs. Don't tell me that your opportunities are so limited that missing out on one job or one college admission has wrecked your life.
 

Ken King

A little rusty but not crusty
PREMO Member
Maynard,

It isn’t that racism doesn’t exist. It does, we all know it and most of us have seen it at work in one form or another. For the most part we all agree that it shouldn’t exist.

However, when discussing “affirmative action” you need to look at what was intended versus what has become. Affirmative action was intended to make life “race and gender neutral”. Which is very noble and aligns well with the Civil Rights Act. Somewhere along the way it was bastardized to mean racial preferences for the “correct race and gender”. Which is totally subversive to the leveling of the playing field.

Today there are many programs that are directed at providing special preference or treatment solely on the basis of race or gender. Individuals with less qualifications are being selected over more highly qualified persons solely because of these programs. It has set about maintaining the fuel that keeps these fires lit and keeps the races and genders apart. Thereby keeping the controversy alive.

As long as there are “affirmative action” programs then there will never be equal opportunity based on ability or qualifications alone.
 

MGKrebs

endangered species
I am pleased that we can all agree that racism exists, and that it is wrong.

Having said that, it seems we should also agree that some form of "levelling the playing field" should exist. But what I hear from the other side of the aisle consists of removing any attempts to force fairness upon us. It seems to consist solely of encouraging minorities to help themselves; no "hand up" even. I think this is a cop out. You get to say the words, but not really DO anything to change the status quo.

If I am wrong, please correct me.

Slavery was outlawed in the 1860's, but it took 100 years more for blacks to get any kind of shot at opportunities we take for granted. Since then we have made progress, but there is much more to do, "in order to build a more perfect union".
 
Top