New World Order

[2ndAmendment]

i dont know about the after life, but i do know about this one, and i am quite capable of recognizing when someone is judging.

logic is a wonderfl thing, when it is exercised, when it is stiflled or influenced by ones faith its not so great.

All logic is influenced by outside experience. Logic is deductive reasoning. Faith does not stifle logic; faith gives new perspective to logic.

 

[tommyjones]

All logic is influenced by outside experience. Logic is deductive reasoning. Faith does not stifle logic; faith gives new perspective to logic.

if your faith is in something that contradicts logic then how is it not stifling to logic? your faith says something cannot be true, but logic says it is. do you use logic or faith when coming to your opinion?

 

[fredcaudle]

if your faith is in something that contradicts logic then how is it not stifling to logic? your faith says something cannot be true, but logic says it is. do you use logic or faith when coming to your opinion?

"your faith says something cannot be true, but logic says it is"

Can you give me an example of this?

 

[2ndAmendment]

if your faith is in something that contradicts logic then how is it not stifling to logic? your faith says something cannot be true, but logic says it is. do you use logic or faith when coming to your opinion?

Sorry. You misunderstand Christian faith.

Matthew 19:26And looking at them Jesus said to them, "With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

My faith says all things are possible. Since my premise is that all logic is influenced by experience, my logic says all things are possible. No conflict.

Remember, the best scientists said the world was flat. It was illogical to believe otherwise.

 

[tommyjones]

Sorry. You misunderstand Christian faith.
My faith says all things are possible. Since my premise is that all logic is influenced by experience, my logic says all things are possible. No conflict.

Remember, the best scientists said the world was flat. It was illogical to believe otherwise.

as i remeber my history, the church was on the late end of accepting the roundness of the earth.


so your faith says that evolution is possible?

 

[fredcaudle]

Read the Old Testament again... it refers to the world as circular. Everybody would have laughed their heads off at that time, because it was most certainly flat according to the experts.

 

[tommyjones]

Read the Old Testament again... it refers to the world as circular. Everybody would have laughed their heads off at that time, because it was most certainly flat according to the experts.

circular and shperical are two different properties. I can see how circular could be taken to mean flat but round, where as spherical means just that.

still, i rememberfrom history class the church was against the change from earth as center of the universe as well as the change to a round earth.

 

[fredcaudle]

circular and shperical are two different properties. I can see how circular could be taken to mean flat but round, where as spherical means just that.

still, i rememberfrom history class the church was against the change from earth as center of the universe as well as the change to a round earth.

So... what does the Bible teach? Church is not the authority, Jesus Christ is. What is your point? Church is bad? Okay... church has been very bad at times in history... Church has been excellent in Jesus Christ at times in history...

"two different properties"... okay... sphere means flat, undeniably to you.

 

[tommyjones]

So... what does the Bible teach? Church is not the authority, Jesus Christ is. What is your point? Church is bad? Okay... church has been very bad at times in history... Church has been excellent in Jesus Christ at times in history...

"two different properties"... okay... sphere means flat, undeniably to you.

spherical= round in 3 deminsions

circular could mean flat but round.

you are a memebr of a church, not a member of jesus

 

[2ndAmendment]

circular and shperical are two different properties. I can see how circular could be taken to mean flat but round, where as spherical means just that.

still, i rememberfrom history class the church was against the change from earth as center of the universe as well as the change to a round earth.

In context, you'll find it in Isiah 40, circle of the earth could also mean the orbit of the earth which would put the Bible far ahead of science. But, for certain, no where does the Bible say the earth is flat.

 

[fredcaudle]

spherical= round in 3 deminsions

circular could mean flat but round.

you are a memebr of a church, not a member of jesus

could mean... does mean... change it to your needs, I guess. Your choice.

Church is "The body of Christ"

We are one with the Father, Son and Spirit (to those who believe)

I am most definitely a member with Jesus... but that is spiritually discerned - you would have to have faith to share in that. "Joint heirs with Jesus" and so on....

 

[tommyjones]

In context, you'll find it in Isiah 40, circle of the earth could also mean the orbit of the earth which would put the Bible far ahead of science. But, for certain, no where does the Bible say the earth is flat.

but for certain, the church did.

 

[tommyjones]

could mean... does mean... change it to your needs, I guess. Your choice.

Church is "The body of Christ"

We are one with the Father, Son and Spirit (to those who believe)

I am most definitely a member with Jesus... but that is spiritually discerned - you would have to have faith to share in that. "Joint heirs with Jesus" and so on....

the church, or "the body of christ" said so, and then changed its tune, not me.

 

[Xaquin44]

Tommy, this is one of those things where, when it can mean two different things, the correct interpretation is the one they want, not the one that is probable. Like most of the bible.

 

[fredcaudle]

but for certain, the church did.

Your faith rests in church apparently... maybe this is the disconnect when we speak on these threads.

We have authority in Jesus Christ (The Word of God)... you keep saying church like that is the authority - its not. [Some churches might believe they are the authority, but Jesus Christ is the Head of the church (NT Greek for church: ecclesia - called out ones). I.e called out by Christ.

 

[fredcaudle]

Tommy, this is one of those things where, when it can mean two different things, the correct interpretation is the one they want, not the one that is probable. Like most of the bible.

LOL.. such double standards

 

[2ndAmendment]

spherical= round in 3 deminsions

circular could mean flat but round.

you are a memebr of a church, not a member of jesus

But you misunderstand the power of God. The Holy Spirit lives within Christians. Christians have God living within them. The Bible evens says Christians are Christ's body.

1 Corinthians 12:26-28

26And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; if one member is honored, all the members rejoice with it.

27Now you are Christ's body, and individually members of it.

28And God has appointed in the church, first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, various kinds of tongues.

I think you need to study the Bible a bit more before you try to tell those that do read it what it says.

 

[2ndAmendment]

but for certain, the church did.

Humans. Not God and not God's word, the Bible.

 

[tommyjones]

Your faith rests in church apparently... maybe this is the disconnect when we speak on these threads.

We have authority in Jesus Christ (The Word of God)... you keep saying church like that is the authority - its not. [Some churches might believe they are the authority, but Jesus Christ is the Head of the church (NT Greek for church: ecclesia - called out ones). I.e called out by Christ.

but you get your info on jesus from the church....


so when the church is worng on something, the faith isn't wrong, its just that we have the wrong understanding of gods word?

 

[Xaquin44]

LOL.. such double standards

fair enough .... but still true =)