Dealing with People "Spreading the Word"

[Tonio]

Originally posted by Voter2002
Isn't weird that thumpers try to "convert" Jews? Convert them to what??? JC was a Jew, wasn't he???

I tried reading the first in the Left Behind series and tossed it aside in disgust. Lots of anti-Semitism. Financiers, scientists and media types are depicted as trying to destory Christianity. And there's lot of descriptions of former Jews recounting their conversions, in the tone of "What was I thinking, being Jewish?"

 

[BudoPo]

Originally posted by Voter2002
Isn't weird that thumpers try to "convert" Jews? Convert them to what??? JC was a Jew, wasn't he???

Yes, Jesus was born Jewish, but Christianity is quite a bit different than Judaism. There are lots of minor differences with major affects on the philosophy of each. Two rather different religions, really, with some common ground.

Originally posted by Tonio
And there's lot of descriptions of former Jews recounting their conversions, in the tone of "What was I thinking, being Jewish?"

Agreed. This kind of attitude (in many areas, not just religion) really rubs me the wrong way. "My religion is right because I know it is, and your views are just plain silly because they're different than mine and I'm to narrow minded to be able to understand it". I once worked with someone like this, who went through life with blinders on. Too each his own, I suppose. Some people like the comfort of staying where they are, others like to explore new things.

 

[MDindef]

I've been told that if you tell the religion peddlers that you're Catholic they steer clear. Not sure why... :

Good morning all...

I am and have been one of those peddlers. You're right that we do these things out of a conviction that this is what we should be doing. I try not to be thoughtless by coming during the dinner hour or when you're trying to put your kids to bed. I know that everyone has a life of their own and I don't wish to intrude. It's just that I believe there's something very important to tell you, and what you do with it is up to you. Here's how I make an "impromptu" visit:

1) Ring the bell - if no one answers or if they immediately say "not interested," I leave.

2) If invited to stay, I tell them who I am and what fellowship I'm from...(that's the big secret - if they don't tell you that, be suspicious).

3) Tell them what I'm doing at their front door! Generally, if we've got something going on like Vacation Bible School or AWANA or youth activities, I just invite them and give them information if they want it. If they don't want it, I don't give it. If they don't want me at their front door anymore, I leave. If they appear to be busy or uncomfortable with my being there, I make my visit very brief and then leave.

(Whether or not they say their Catholic at this point does not intimidate me. But the reason that some will go away is that fundamental Christians believe that Catholics are so rooted in the traditions of their beliefs that they will never listen.)

4) If invited to continue, I may ask their thoughts about heaven, and how one gets there. If I'm not invited to continue, I leave.

5) I sometimes ask if I can explain how the Bible answers that question. If invited to, I do so. If not, I leave.

It may suprise you to know that for every person that's annoyed by my showing up, there is another that is happy that I did. What many don't understand is that their neighbors are hurting. In a day where everyone's in it for themselves, next door neighbors could be alone with their troubles and no one would no about it. Drunk fathers, battered wives, drugged up teens, depression, job problems, people that need food or clothes, people that need to know that someone, anyone, cares about them. This is an area of ministry that local churches should be involved in, and to find out about these things, we must (as Jesus taught us), go...

Thanks for your time.

 

[Tonio]

Thanks for your thoughts, MDindef.

I believe in God, and I also believe that religious belief is something very personal. Everyone has some form of personal revelation about the nature of our existence. There is no "one true faith." I always try to respect others' personal religious beliefs. MDindef, I'm grateful to you for doing the same.

What angers me is when any species of believer gets in other people's faces and tells them, "You're going to hell because you don't believe X." In my opinion, this is the most evil thing that a person can say. Worse than "You deserve to die," and worse than "Your mother's a whore." It is an outrageous example of not respecting others' religious beliefs. But this goes on every day. It goes on the Left Behind series, and it goes on when Falwell and Robertson cast blame for the 9/11 attacks.

 

[MDindef]

Thanks for welcoming my thoughts Tonio.

When someone says something like "you're going to hell," it always matters what their attitude is. Are they genuinely concerned or are they judging you? Most of the time, it's the latter. The reason I tell others of my faith is that I don't want them to go!

You know of course that as a fundamental Christian, I believe that there is no other way to God but through Jesus. I hope to live my life in such a way that others will know there's some substance to what I believe. I don't believe a judgmental attitude will accomplish that. Of course I have to be discerning, but my overall genuine concern for humanity and for the individual person should override any attitude I may have.

I hope that in this way, I "earn" the privilege of sharing my faith with people.

 

[Penn]

Spreading the Word

MDindef: I've yet to have a person with your thoughtfulness come to my home to spread the message . Perhaps, if more Disciples(and I do believe that you are) came to people's houses with that message, there'd be greater peace in this world. Why? Because more people would be willing to receive it.
However, as some of our folks have noted, when those people come to judge, and you CAN SENSE their feeling, it is a turnoff. No one said it would be an easy task to deliver God's message to humanity, and I suppose not everyone is adequately equipped to administer it either. Maybe some are too
pumped up with their own sense of "The Way", they disregard the very people they are trying to bring the Good News to.

As has been noted, prejudging another's needs is a terrible thing to do.

penncam

 

[BudoPo]

I have yet to meet someone with MDidef's consideration, too. Usually they don't get the hint when I tell them that I'm not interested. They're usually polite, and I'm polite in return, but they don't understand that I don't share their beliefs. Once or twice, I've discussed it with them, and their reasoning just made me more firm in my own beliefs and not theirs. If I tell them I'm Jewish, then they have a whole set of arguments aimed directly at "saving" Jews. From the pamphlets they've given me, 90% of the arguments are based on inaccurate views of my religion.

But that really kind of irks me: the directed effort towards a particular group, of which they have little understanding.

But, like I've said, I understand that in their view, they're doing something good. So, I normally don't go off about why I feel that their beliefs are wrong. So long as they're polite and leave when I say I'm not interested, then it's really just a minor nuisance.

End of rant.

 

[Penn]

"Spreading the Word"

AMEN to that, BudoPo!!!

 

[Kain99]

Bottom Line!

God the Father
Jesus the Son........................

Anything else pure BS............

See ya'll in heaven! praying!

 

[jimmy]

Sold! I've never heard a more convincing arguement for Christianity in my life. Who's got some holy water? Let's get ta baptizin'....

 

[BudoPo]

My favorite prayer (heard it from some guy from Texas on the MacNeil/Lehrer Newshour once; I forgot the discussion topic):

"Lord, let me seek the truth, but spare me from those who know it."

Now, I don't go around talking about all the reasons I don't believe in Christianity (not just because I wasn't born Christian; there are a lot of philosophical and dogmatic issues). I'm sure I'd insult most of my friends by doing that. They also don't impose their views on me. The "if you don't believe what I do, then you're eternally damned, so I have a duty to save you" attitude is what I find annoying.

Kain99, if you're that firm in your beliefs, great. In all honesty, I think it's a good thing for you. But please respect that others have different views.

 

[Kain99]

Is an apology appropriate?

Originally posted by BudoPo

Kain99, if you're that firm in your beliefs, great. In all honesty, I think it's a good thing for you. But please respect that others have different views.

So... You find it direspectful for me to post my beilefs? If your asking me to be be politically correct forget it! It is not my job to stroke your ego.

 

[Kain99]

I'm pretty sure that BudPo took my statement as a direct slam toward anyone who does not belive in God.... In all honesty my comment was directed at all of the crazy BS the relgious try to sell us. personally speaking I feel that Religion does more damage than it does good... Doctorine divides, that wasn't God's plan... Leave it to us humans to screw it all up!

 

[Tonio]

Originally posted by Kain99
I'm pretty sure that BudPo took my statement as a direct slam toward anyone who does not belive in God.... In all honesty my comment was directed at all of the crazy BS the relgious try to sell us. personally speaking I feel that Religion does more damage than it does good... Doctorine divides, that wasn't God's plan... Leave it to us humans to screw it all up!

I don't condemn all religion, but I do agree with you about doctrine. It even divides believers against one another. Christian denominations went to war centuries ago over the status of Mary and whether salvation came from faith or good works or both. Sunni Muslims and Shiite Muslims have fought constantly over the role of mullahs in the faith.

 

[BudoPo]

I didn't mean at all to imply that you shouldn't post your views. Forums like this are intended for discussions of people's views. I was just stating that not everyone shares a particular faith or belief system. Your beliefs seem to be good for you. Mine are different, and are good for me. I just don't appreciate people trying to impose their views on other people. Just consider if someone came to you and started pointing out where (in their view) your faith is wrong. It'd be kind of annoying, wouldn't it?

I (almost) agree with your statement that religion, historically, has caused more harm than good. I think it's not religion itself, but when two groups feel the need to convert each other that causes trouble.

I'm not sure where that crack about my ego came from, so I won't comment on it.

I didn't take your comment as a slam against anyone, though your comments could be read that way. I took it the way I thought you inteded: that you have a firm belief in your faith, and other views are not correct.

By the way, I never said I don't believe in God. I don't believe in Jesus (aside from him being someone who lived in what is now Israel 2,000 years ago). But I didn't say one way or another about my belief in God (or "gods", just to throw polytheism in there).

 

[Kain99]

Faith is a sensitive issue... You are entitled to beleive in anything you want to. I am equally entitled. I honestly have no interest in converting you.

It is my right to post my ideas and beliefs regardless of your continuing attempts to shut me up.

Let's agree to disagree -

 

[vraiblonde]

Kain, I'll give you some history - BudoPo is the VERY LAST person who would try to shut ANYONE up. It's not what he does.

 

[Kain99]

Your right

Originally posted by cariblue
Kain, no one has made any attempt to shut you up. What is your problem today?

Loosing my mind I think.... Sorry Budpo your not the only person I have attacked in the last 24 hours. It's not personal, Your life is based on your faith, I respect that.

 

[BudoPo]

Kain,

No harm done. I've been on a few bb's and learned the hard way to really think about how I word something (since people will usually read things in a vastly different way than you intended).

BTW, I know it sounded like I was saying you were trying to convert me, but I realize you're not. That was just what started this thread, which is why I replied that way.

At least it sounds like we can let each other live with our respective faiths and beliefs.

Cari, Vrai, thanks for the understanding and support.

 

[BudoPo]

Kain,

No harm done. I've been on a few bb's and learned the hard way to really think about how I word something (since people will usually read things in a vastly different way than you intended).

BTW, I know it sounded like I was saying you were trying to convert me, but I realize you're not. That was just what started this thread, which is why I replied that way.

At least it sounds like we can let each other live with our respective faiths and beliefs.

Cari, Vrai, thanks for the understanding and support.