Electric Car News

Kyle

Beloved Misanthrope
PREMO Member



I know some folks with trucks. Some use them to tow boats. Usually twice a year. Others use them to get the spring and fall mulch. But most just like being up above traffic and feeling safer because of it.

Of course this doesnt count fleets and tradespeople.
And I'd bet money my 2004 has done more work hauling and towing than every electric truck on the road combined.
 

phreddyp

Well-Known Member
Just because you claim one doesn't make it real for most owners. I acknowledge them all but I also know many of them are BS individual stories that don't apply to the vast majority of owners. "Nobody want them" you say. I point to massive increases in sales. "People buy them once and then dump them" you say, and I point to the fact that the only group that doesn't stick with them is people who decided to buy them without being able to charge them at home. And that most owners not only replace theirs with another one, they quite often buy a second.

Here's the key. You always point to anecdotes of individuals (usually idiots). I always point to verifiable information made up of thousands of data points. What have I blindly ignored? Your idiot neighbors? Nope, we discussed he fact that they made bad choices. Buying a Sharpsonic car stereo from the back of the flea market doesn't mean car stereos suck, just that you chose a crappy one.
Let me correct this for you, if you bought an EV you chose a crappy one, because that is ALL that is out there.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
And I'd bet money my 2004 has done more work hauling and towing than every electric truck on the road combined.
And I bet my wife 's 2015 Jeep Cherokee has done more towing and hauling than a great majority of the non-trade f-150s out there. But again, let's not confuse anecdotes with data and individual use cases with a great majority of a thing.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
Let me correct this for you, if you bought an EV you chose a crappy one, because that is ALL that is out there.
Yet you who doesn't own one has decided that all of the millions of EVs that make people happy across the globe are crap. Here's the thing. Even if you own five of them that still is statistically insignificant number.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
Hey, we finally have a good breakdown on why that damn Rivian cost 42,000 to repair. And it has nothing to do with the fact that it's an EV and everything to do with it being a brand new company that decided to make things easier to build than repair. Something Monroe noted repeatedly during their teardown. God it's nice to have factual data and not memes to work with

 

phreddyp

Well-Known Member
Hey, we finally have a good breakdown on why that damn Rivian cost 42,000 to repair. And it has nothing to do with the fact that it's an EV and everything to do with it being a brand new company that decided to make things easier to build than repair. Something Monroe noted repeatedly during their teardown. God it's nice to have factual data and not memes to work with

Just one more piece of junk!
 

phreddyp

Well-Known Member
Yet you who doesn't own one has decided that all of the millions of EVs that make people happy across the globe are crap. Here's the thing. Even if you own five of them that still is statistically insignificant number.
Which brand do you own and drive?
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
Here's the key. You always point to anecdotes of individuals
Two things -

It is entirely reasonable and logical to trust the "ancedotes" - aka real-life experiences - of people you actually KNOW - versus piles of data and reports. Even if it is just ONE person you know.

Second - years ago, I was going into some possibly risky surgery. I asked my surgeon how many of these he had done. "Over 3000". And how many patients have you lost during this surgery? "ZERO". Good enough for me - but had he said a number greater than ONE - I might have gone home. People don't want to know that their plane isn't going to crash 90% of the time. They want 100.

I've mentioned here and elsewhere - make the car SO COMPELLING TO HAVE, I will actually DUMP my car and shell out the bucks for it. That is what people DO, when it is that good. The modern bicycle - as opposed to the giant penny-farthing types - when they hit the street, there were tens of thousands of them within a few YEARS. When the Wright Brothers flew at Kitty Hawk, their ideas powered a revolution such that they were flying over the English Channel just six years later. Four years after that, they were dogfighting over Europe.

People joke about resisting new technology, but when its adoption is compelling and affordable, people FLOCK to it.
 

Clem72

Well-Known Member
Two things -

It is entirely reasonable and logical to trust the "ancedotes" - aka real-life experiences - of people you actually KNOW - versus piles of data and reports. Even if it is just ONE person you know.

Second - years ago, I was going into some possibly risky surgery. I asked my surgeon how many of these he had done. "Over 3000". And how many patients have you lost during this surgery? "ZERO". Good enough for me - but had he said a number greater than ONE - I might have gone home. People don't want to know that their plane isn't going to crash 90% of the time. They want 100.
I'm going to assume any time you ask your pilot how many times they have crashed a plane the answer is going to be zero. Unless maybe you are using the St. Mary's airport.
 

SamSpade

Well-Known Member
I'm going to assume any time you ask your pilot how many times they have crashed a plane the answer is going to be zero. Unless maybe you are using the St. Mary's airport.
Yes, except I would ask the airline, just as I wouldn't ask my cabbie how many fatal accidents he'd had.

Did you ever see "Rain Man" where Dustin Hoffman's character was terrified of flying? Tom Cruise tells him they've all had crashes sooner or later.

"Not Qantas. Never had a crash". That's still true.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
Which brand do you own and drive?

I don't, but then again I'm the advocating for taking the overall data.

Two things -

It is entirely reasonable and logical to trust the "ancedotes" - aka real-life experiences - of people you actually KNOW - versus piles of data and reports. Even if it is just ONE person you know.

Second - years ago, I was going into some possibly risky surgery. I asked my surgeon how many of these he had done. "Over 3000". And how many patients have you lost during this surgery? "ZERO". Good enough for me - but had he said a number greater than ONE - I might have gone home. People don't want to know that their plane isn't going to crash 90% of the time. They want 100.

I've mentioned here and elsewhere - make the car SO COMPELLING TO HAVE, I will actually DUMP my car and shell out the bucks for it. That is what people DO, when it is that good. The modern bicycle - as opposed to the giant penny-farthing types - when they hit the street, there were tens of thousands of them within a few YEARS. When the Wright Brothers flew at Kitty Hawk, their ideas powered a revolution such that they were flying over the English Channel just six years later. Four years after that, they were dogfighting over Europe.

People joke about resisting new technology, but when its adoption is compelling and affordable, people FLOCK to it.

I know the anecdotes are true. But I also know that people can be idiots and things are hard for them. Take Intex above ground pools. Lots of people know people who have had disastrous experiences with them. Are they bad pools? Nope, been using them for 20 years now and every time there's been an issue, its been on me. So anecdotal information has its places, but you have to know whos telling the anecdote to know how much weight to give it. If my best friend in the whole worlds tell me a piece of tech is for crap, I need to look at it myself. I'd help the guy bury a body, but he's a self admitted caveman.

Or if your peoples real life experience is with a lesser quality product, say a $100 camera drone, would you say that DJI Mavic products are crap? If they buy a burner no name phone from a drugstore and tell you smart phones are crap, would you say Iphones and Galaxy phones are horrible products?

On to your second point. Maybe I'm weird, I know nothing in this world is 100%. And I've spent a lifetime doing things others consider dangerous. Aircrew in Navy aircraft, loading weapons onto those aircraft, riding motorcycles, driving fast cars. When my spinal surgery was inevitable, I was regaled with stories about fusions that didn't work. Implored to find another way. I trusted my surgeon to present the risks to me squarely. Of course, his numbers matched with the research papers I had read.


The EV tech is approaching the flocking point, but it wont be there for a while. The interdependence of materials, tech advances, infrastructure all will pull and tug until we hit that point. Its truly not a valid solution for every use case, lots of niches out there. and still large blocks like city dwellers without easy access to charging. For some people, the compelling case is there, it all depends on the value you place on various parts of the ownership equation.

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