Jesus is either the biggest fraud in history or He is exactly who He claims to be.

[2ndAmendment]

Those that do as Christ said and repent and make ammends as in taking the beam out of our own eye and then the sin is gone.

Jesus gives absolution through repentance.

Thus guiltless and innocent there-after.

When I judge others then I expect to be judged myself, and rightly so.

You got that right. Good. Now do you see why not everyone gets saved? You said it yourself, "Jesus gives absolution through repentance." Not everyone will repent. The Bible says so.

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

You got that right. Good. Now do you see why not everyone gets saved? You said it yourself, "Jesus gives absolution through repentance." Not everyone will repent. The Bible says so.

People fail to repent in this world and that is why this world is messed up.

So very many people do not get saved now in this lifetime.

But on judgement Day then everyone will see and know and then all shall confess and everyone will get saved at that time.

 

[2ndAmendment]

People fail to repent in this world and that is why this world is messed up.

So very many people do not get saved now in this lifetime.

But on judgement Day then everyone will see and know and then all shall confess and everyone will get saved at that time.

And that is where the modernism has led you astray. Once you are dead in this life, it is too late to repent. It is absolutely true that every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus, the Christ, is Lord, but that is commanded and not an act of repentance because the time to repent is in this life. Judgment day is too late to repent.

I trust you will see your error.

The Bible is the Truth.

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

And that is where the modernism has led you astray. Once you are dead in this life, it is too late to repent. It is absolutely true that every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus, the Christ, is Lord, but that is commanded and not an act of repentance because the time to repent is in this life. Judgment day is too late to repent.

2A is not quoting the Bible correctly and his interpretation is not what the Bible says link HERE.

It is not just 2A as it is the Orthodox Christianity too that are mis-judging others as being doomed and going to some fire in Hell but the Bible says Jesus is the savior both for the living and for the dead.

The truth remains that no one gets left out and everyone gets saved.

 

[2ndAmendment]

...

The truth remains that no one gets left out and everyone gets saved.

Well, I have to call that what it is, a lie straight from satan.

I trust that one day you will come to know the Truth and accept the Bible for what it is, the inerrant Word of God.

 

[JPC sr]

Batman

Well, I have to call that what it is, a lie straight from satan.

See 2A calls it a lie but I gave the text in a link for anyone to see and read it for ourselves and I gave a correct interpretation that actually matched the words of the text.

Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess - so everybody gets saved, but 2A is saying not everyone as some are already burning in his mystical hell fire but mine matches the Bible verses.

The problem is that people like 2A are only preaching what the Orthodox have brain washed into him and he can not interpret the Bible verses with his own beliefs because then he too would become un-Orthodox.

We each and everyone needs to read the Bible for ourselves and make our own individual findings based on our own feelings and our own perception and stop having others telling us what we must believe.

 

[2ndAmendment]

See 2A calls it a lie but I gave the text in a link for anyone to see and read it for ourselves and I gave a correct interpretation that actually matched the words of the text.

Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess - so everybody gets saved, but 2A is saying not everyone as some are already burning in his mystical hell fire but mine matches the Bible verses.

The problem is that people like 2A are only preaching what the Orthodox have brain washed into him and he can not interpret the Bible verses with his own beliefs because then he too would become un-Orthodox.

We each and everyone needs to read the Bible for ourselves and make our own individual findings based on our own feelings and our own perception and stop having others telling us what we must believe.

I called what you posted what it is. Saying that everyone gets saved is a lie.

And JPC's problem is that he is looking for some out. It may be for someone who has died and was not a Christian. That would be sad but is the case for many. He is accepting modern myths and rejecting the Bible. He chooses to ignore the scripture with which he does not personally agree. He ignores:

Matthew 7:13-14

13"Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.

14"For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

and

Matthew 7:21-23

21"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.

22"Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'

23"And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

and

Revelation 20: 15And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

and

Revelation 21:8"But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."

JPC has chosen the path that was describe in the Bible about many in the last days.

2 Timthy 3:2-7

2For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy,

3unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,

4treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,

5holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.

6For among them are those who enter into households and captivate weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses,

7always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

and

2 Timothy 4:3-5

3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,

4and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths.

He is right that every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus is Lord.

Philippians 2:9-16

9For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name,

10so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth,

11and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

12So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling;

13for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.

14Do all things without grumbling or disputing;

15so that you will prove yourselves to be blameless and innocent, children of God above reproach in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, among whom you appear as lights in the world,

16holding fast the word of life, so that in the day of Christ I will have reason to glory because I did not run in vain nor toil in vain.

JPC ignores verse 15 that delineates between those that believe and "a crooked and perverse generation." The crooked and perverse may kneel and bow and confess that Jesus is Lord, but it will be just before they are cast into the lake of fire.

I trust that someday, JPC will have the scales fall from his eyes.

 

[JPC sr]

Mr. Ferrari

I called what you posted what it is. Saying that everyone gets saved is a lie.

Well I stand by my interpretations and my beliefs as mine are true and mine are correct.

2A and Orthodox Christianity can certainly believe all they choose to believe.

I have no real problem with them thinking they are the only chosen ones and that others like myself might cook in a Hell fire for all eternity.

For myself when I found out that there is no Hell (people on fire being tortured) then it was a great relief to me because I would never accept a situation like that nor would I accept a God like that.

So it works for me.

 

[This_person]

Well I stand by my interpretations and my beliefs as mine are true and mine are correct.

Are you sure you do? Aren't you the same guy who stands so strongly behind his beliefs that you said: "I agree with this completely even though it does not agree entirely with my own religious beliefs," clearly explaining that you agree with stuff you don't agree with?

For myself when I found out that there is no Hell (people on fire being tortured) then it was a great relief to me

With the life you've lead, you really need to believe this. I understand. You have no concept of what repentance really means, so you choose to believe that you'll be forgiven even though you haven't changed your ways or really seen the light with your sins.

 

[camily]

Well I stand by my interpretations and my beliefs as mine are true and mine are correct.

2A and Orthodox Christianity can certainly believe all they choose to believe.

I have no real problem with them thinking they are the only chosen ones and that others like myself might cook in a Hell fire for all eternity.

For myself when I found out that there is no Hell (people on fire being tortured) then it was a great relief to me because I would never accept a situation like that nor would I accept a God like that.

So it works for me.

Revelation
Chapter 20
1
1 Then I saw an angel come down from heaven, holding in his hand the key to the abyss 2 and a heavy chain.
2
He seized the dragon, the ancient serpent, which is the Devil or Satan, 3 and tied it up for a thousand years
3
and threw it into the abyss, which he locked over it and sealed, so that it could no longer lead the nations astray until the thousand years are completed. After this, it is to be released for a short time.
4
Then I saw thrones; those who sat on them were entrusted with judgment. I also saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, and who had not worshiped the beast or its image nor had accepted its mark 4 on their foreheads or hands. They came to life and they reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
5
The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were over. This is the first resurrection.
6
Blessed 5 and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over these; they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for (the) thousand years.
7
6 When the thousand years are completed, Satan will be released from his prison.
8
He will go out to deceive the nations at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, 7 to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea.
9
They invaded the breadth of the earth 8 and surrounded the camp of the holy ones and the beloved city. But fire came down from heaven and consumed them.
10
The Devil who had led them astray was thrown into the pool of fire and sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet were. There they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
11
9 Next I saw a large white throne and the one who was sitting on it. The earth and the sky fled from his presence and there was no place for them.
12
I saw the dead, the great and the lowly, standing before the throne, and scrolls were opened. Then another scroll was opened, the book of life. 10 The dead were judged according to their deeds, by what was written in the scrolls.
13
The sea gave up its dead; then Death and Hades 11 gave up their dead. All the dead were judged according to their deeds.
14
Then Death and Hades were thrown into the pool of fire. (This pool of fire is the second death. 12 )
15
Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the pool of fire.

 

[JPC sr]

Mr. Ferrari

Are you sure you do? Aren't you the same guy who stands so strongly behind his beliefs that you said: "I agree with this completely even though it does not agree entirely with my own religious beliefs," clearly explaining that you agree with stuff you don't agree with?

There is no contradiction there as I was refering to the poster trying to figure out the Bible and he did it very well indeed.

But his conclusions are his own and I fully agree with that.

With me then no one has got to agree with me to still be honest and true.

My personal relationship with God is not dependant on any other person(s) and I respect the personal beliefs of others.

You have no concept of what repentance really means, so you choose to believe that you'll be forgiven even though you haven't changed your ways or really seen the light with your sins.

I have often referenced and explained "repentance" as I still believe it was the bottom line - true message that Christ brought in His birth and His resurection.

Salvation through repentance, link HERE.

Of course I see this poster only complained at my lacking yet gave no definition of his own like it must be another of those mysterious Christianily secrets - I say not.

To repent one must make ammends for the wrongs committed.

It is very simple to understand but takes humility to perform.

 

[JPC sr]

Mr. Ferrari

Revelation
Chapter 20, [ link HERE. ]

14
Then Death and Hades were thrown into the pool of fire. (This pool of fire is the second death. 12 )
15
Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the pool of fire.

It says "death" would be thrown in and not living people, so death could mean dead people but not living souls,

and it says "hades" (Hell) would be thrown in but again not living people or souls in fire torment torture.

Link to "Hades" HERE.

We must read and believe what it says and not what others like the Orthodox tell us it says.

It does not matter after death what you or anyone does here on earth, because God already forgave us all and Jesus paid the punishment in full and our Loving Father in Heaven does not torture and burn people in the mystical deception called Hell.

If we sin now then we pay for it now, we reap what we sow, but Judgement Day is to be a wonderful event for everyone.

So it pays to do the right stuff now because we live hard from doing wrong link HERE.

 

[camily]

It says "death" would be thrown in and not living people, so death could mean dead people but not living souls,

and it says "hades" (Hell) would be thrown in but again not living people or souls in fire torment torture.

Link to "Hades" HERE.

We must read and believe what it says and not what others like the Orthodox tell us it says.

It does not matter after death what you or anyone does here on earth, because God already forgave us all and Jesus paid the punishment in full and our Loving Father in Heaven does not torture and burn people in the mystical deception called Hell.

If we sin now then we pay for it now, we reap what we sow, but Judgement Day is to be a wonderful event for everyone.

So it pays to do the right stuff now because we live hard from doing wrong link HERE.

If you believe the Bible, you MUST believe in hell.

 

[camily]

Matthew 25
31
14 "When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit upon his glorious throne,
32
and all the nations 15 will be assembled before him. And he will separate them one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.
33
He will place the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.
34
Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father. Inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.
35
For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, a stranger and you welcomed me,
36
naked and you clothed me, ill and you cared for me, in prison and you visited me.'
37
Then the righteous 16 will answer him and say, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink?
38
When did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?
39
When did we see you ill or in prison, and visit you?'
40
And the king will say to them in reply, 'Amen, I say to you, whatever you did for one of these least brothers of mine, you did for me.'
41
17 Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you accursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
42
For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink,
43
a stranger and you gave me no welcome, naked and you gave me no clothing, ill and in prison, and you did not care for me.'
44
18 Then they will answer and say, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or ill or in prison, and not minister to your needs?'
45
He will answer them, 'Amen, I say to you, what you did not do for one of these least ones, you did not do for me.'
46
And these will go off to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."

 

[JPC sr]

Mr. Ferrari

If you believe the Bible, you MUST believe in hell.

The difference is in how one interpret the words.

In the Bible "Hell" means the grave like dead people are buried in a cave or in the ground and that is the hell of the Bible.

So I do believe in hell but it is just the place to put dead bodies in a grave.

That false "Hell" of fire and torment is a man made concept to frighten and to control the sheep.

Plus the concept of "hell" directly defies the clear message that Christ paid the penalty for sin in full.

The command is to "love thy enemies" link HERE and God does not break His own commands.

 

[This_person]

There is no contradiction there

When you say you agree with something, and then say you don't agree with it, that's sort of the definition of a contradiction. English - learn it, live it.

With me then no one has got to agree with me to still be honest and true.

You're close. With you, no one CAN agree with you (overall) and still be honest and true.

I have often referenced and explained "repentance"

Yes, you have. But, you still don't understand it.

To repent one must make ammends for the wrongs committed. It is very simple to understand but takes humility to perform.

It is very easy to understand. However, given your statements on your "family" (or, rather, your ex-spouse and her husband's family), you have not made ammends for your wrongs - you defend them and preach for others to act as you did. You not only have no humility, you claim to be the only one worldwide who understands what the Bible really means, and what the morality of parenting one must act with. Everyone else is wrong, and you feel obligated to correct the rest of the world. That's not humility, that's unfounded arrogance. That's not repentance, that's excuses.

 

[JPC sr]

Mr. Ferrari

Matthew 25 [ link HERE ]

17 Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you accursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

46
And these will go off to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."

The "eternal fire" is saying the works (sins) will be burned and destroyed but not the person link HERE.

It is to hate the sin but do not hate the sinner.

We all are children of God and we all will be saved by our Creator.

God is love and He even loves His enemies, and He does not torture and burn people.

 

[JPC sr]

Mr. Ferrari

That's not humility, that's unfounded arrogance.

It seems that I have always admired "arrogance" and even here I see it more as a virtue than not.

Perhaps I would say that it does take humility in repentance and I am all for that,

but later when confronted by the self righteous like the above poster then humility steps aside for the arrogance that the poster inspires.

So it goes like this:

1) Humility for repentance.

2) Arrogance against the self righteous.

 

[This_person]

So it goes like this:

1) Humility for repentance.

2) Arrogance against the self righteous.

You've got #2 down (at least the arrogance part), but you haven't touched number 1 yet

 

[2ndAmendment]

Jpc,
You are preaching a lie.

May God remove the scales from your eyes.