What is it about the gays?..

[baydoll]

And I have no idea what you’re going on about. I am not offended by what gays do, or anyone else for that matter. As a biblical matter (which is the standard Christians are supposed to follow) you can read my previous post where Jesus was questioned for this exact same thing; serving up to sinners. These bakers showed how willing they are to judge rather than love, and how unwilling they are to serve. And I don’t mean serving a cake. Perhaps those are the HYPOCRITICAL SELF RIGHTEOUS CHRISTIANS we need to be talking about; those that claim to be full of God’s love, then spitting in someone’s face for being sinners.

And for a true measure of what this means, even when Jesus was being crucified – one of the most torturous ways to die – he still forgave them “FOR THEY KNOW NOT WHAT THEY DO”.

Can you please show us where these people (the bakery) spit in anyone's faces?

Seems like you're doing a lot of spitting there yourself, Sir.

I don't know if you are aware of this but this bakery never said it wouldn't SERVE THEM AT ALL, they told them (politely) they wouldn't be able to make them a WEDDING CAKE, for crying out loud. And then politely told them WHY they would not be able to do so. The bakery told them they can sell them anything else BUT a special order WEDDING CAKE which would violate their conscience, doing/participating in something they were against (gay marriage). Sheesh!

I mean, how hard is this???

I have a gay son even HE and HIS GAY FRIENDS think this is beyond ridiculous.

 

[baydoll]

Originally Posted by PsyOps View Post

And I have no idea what you’re going on about. I am not offended by what gays do, or anyone else for that matter. As a biblical matter (which is the standard Christians are supposed to follow) you can read my previous post where Jesus was questioned for this exact same thing; serving up to sinners. These bakers showed how willing they are to judge rather than love, and how unwilling they are to serve. And I don’t mean serving a cake. Perhaps those are the HYPOCRITICAL SELF RIGHTEOUS CHRISTIANS we need to be talking about; those that claim to be full of God’s love, then spitting in someone’s face for being sinners.

And for a true measure of what this means, even when Jesus was being crucified – one of the most torturous ways to die – he still forgave them “FOR THEY KNOW NOT WHAT THEY DO”.

So would that include Pedophiles as well? Or 40 year old Muslim men who marry 6 year old girls? Would you 'serve them' too? And forgive them their sins even if they had no desire whatsoever to give up said sins?

After all, they're sinners too.

The bakers were not judging gays. There is a HUGE difference between them saying WE DO NOT SERVE GAYS IN THIS BAKERY BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SCUMS OF THE EARTH AND WE SPIT IN THEIR FACES (which they didn't) to saying we do not bake a special order wedding cake for gay marriages .

NOWHERE did they say they hated gays. NOWHERE.

YOU are the ones judging these people, PsyOps. Try taking that LOG out of your OWN eyes before you go trying to remove splinters out of others.

 

[Radiant1]

Judging much, Radiant?

No, and I said nothing that should lead you to think so.

 

[baydoll]

No, and I said nothing that should lead you to think so.

You are right and I apologize... how about we start over fresh and be friends from here on out?

 

[Larry Gude]

You are right and I apologize... how about we start over fresh and be friends from here on out?

Good morning. I was wondering if you answered my question as to when, and how, you chose your sexuality? Did I miss your reply? Not trying to be antagonistic but, trying to make the point. EVERY gay person I know did not choose to be gay. And I don't know anyone who chose to be heterosexual. For me, I've just always been attracted to women and not attracted to males. There was never a choice. It just is so, long ago, I rationalized that that is probably the case with everyone else, including gays. Based on the emphasis many folks place on sexuality being a choice, including, it seems, you, I ask the question; did you choose yours?

 

[baydoll]

Good morning. I was wondering if you answered my question as to when, and how, you chose your sexuality? Did I miss your reply? Not trying to be antagonistic but, trying to make the point. EVERY gay person I know did not choose to be gay. And I don't know anyone who chose to be heterosexual. For me, I've just always been attracted to women and not attracted to males. There was never a choice. It just is so, long ago, I rationalized that that is probably the case with everyone else, including gays. Based on the emphasis many folks place on sexuality being a choice, including, it seems, you, I ask the question; did you choose yours?

Good Morning to you too, Mr. Gude!

The reason why I didn't answer that particular question of yours was because it had nothing to do with the topic at hand, which was some bakery's decision not to bake a gay wedding cake.

But being as you want to know my thoughts on this (and this is coming from a mom who has a gay son) I will do my utmost to answer your question.

My son said the very same words to me, he didn't choose to be gay. But actually he DID choose to be gay. We all have feelings we don't choose (or do choose). We choose to feel hatred towards someone or a certain group of people (which would make us bigots), or to feel love for someone other than our spouses (which would make us adulterers) or chose to feel love and have a sexual relationship with someone of our own sex. Those feelings aren't choices but we do choose whether or not to act on them. Like you, I choose to be heterosexual but that's not my particular bent towards sin. It wasn't sex for me, it was drugs when I was younger and alcohol as I grew older. I choose to follow my 'desires' for them but then came a point in my life when I decided to follow Christ and I choose not to indulge in those desires anymore.

We all have feelings at times which aren't necessarily right and which we shouldn't give in to. And just because we have these feelings doesn't mean God gave them to us. I have feelings too that I have to resist. God ask me to take up my crosses daily and follow Him and live obediently. That means giving up my 'self'. And if part of my 'self' is my proclivity towards a sexual desire that is wrong than I will give that particular sin up.

Plenty of people have 'selves' too, by the way. They may choose to indulge their 'selves' but as Christians I'm called to something different. I'm not here to satisfy my 'self', I'm here to lose them. In the long run that's the only way to really find our true 'selves' anyway.

 

[PsyOps]

I don't know if you are aware of this but this bakery never said it wouldn't SERVE THEM AT ALL, they told them (politely) they wouldn't be able to make them a WEDDING CAKE, for crying out loud. And then politely told them WHY they would not be able to do so. The bakery told them they can sell them anything else BUT a special order WEDDING CAKE which would violate their conscience, doing/participating in something they were against (gay marriage). Sheesh!

I mean, how hard is this???

I have a gay son even HE and HIS GAY FRIENDS think this is beyond ridiculous.

A distinction without a difference. They sent a clear message that if you don't think the way I do I refuse to have anything to do with you. If Jesus had taken this position Matthew would have never been a disciple.

 

[PsyOps]

YOU are the ones judging these people, PsyOps. Try taking that LOG out of your OWN eyes before you go trying to remove splinters out of others.

I am making a judgment about what they DID, not who they are. If I owned a business, I wouldn’t refuse them anymore than I would refuse a gay couple or anyone else for that matter. What better way to tell folks that God loves them than to act in a way that shows God loves them? These people conveyed the message that God doesn’t love them because they are gay. It apparently needs to be stated over and over… love the sinner, hate the sin.

 

[Makavide]

A distinction without a difference. They sent a clear message that if you don't think the way I do I refuse to have anything to do with you. If Jesus had taken this position Matthew would have never been a disciple.

Did Matthew change his ways?

You all keep saying that Jesus served the sinners. He did not. He saved the sinners. Brought them out of their sinful ways. He did not go about this by saying "what you are doing is ok, keep doing it". He said "go forth and sin no more".

Now the tax collectors and sinners were all gathering around to hear Jesus. But the Pharisees and the teachers of the law muttered, “This man welcomes sinners and eats with them.”

Then Jesus told them this parable: “Suppose one of you has a hundred sheep and loses one of them. Doesn’t he leave the ninety-nine in the open country and go after the lost sheep until he finds it? And when he finds it, he joyfully puts it on his shoulders and goes home. Then he calls his friends and neighbors together and says, ‘Rejoice with me; I have found my lost sheep.’ I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent.

Here Jesus is telling us that when he finds the lost sheep (sinner) and brings him back to the flock (out of it's sinful ways) life is grand. No where in this parable did Jesus say that he and the lost sheep hung out together enjoying grass....

 

[PsyOps]

Did Matthew change his ways?

You all keep saying that Jesus served the sinners. He did not. He saved the sinners. Brought them out of their sinful ways. He did not go about this by saying "what you are doing is ok, keep doing it". He said "go forth and sin no more".

“…just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” – Matthew 20:28

Here Jesus is telling us that when he finds the lost sheep (sinner) and brings him back to the flock (out of it's sinful ways) life is grand. No where in this parable did Jesus say that he and the lost sheep hung out together enjoying grass....

Where would Matthew had been if Jesus hadn't come into his life? The point I’m trying to make is Jesus did not choose so-called ‘upstanding’ people of the temple or from high, learned places within the Sanhedrin. He chose lowly people; people that were considered to be of questionable character. Why did he do this? Why don’t Christians today do this? They stick to themselves and reject everyone else. Kind of the same thing Jesus lambasted the leaders of the temples of those days (Matthew 23).

 

[Larry Gude]

Good Morning to you too, Mr. Gude!

The reason why I didn't answer that particular question of yours was because it had nothing to do with the topic at hand, which was some bakery's decision not to bake a gay wedding cake.

But being as you want to know my thoughts on this (and this is coming from a mom who has a gay son) I will do my utmost to answer your question.

My son said the very same words to me, he didn't choose to be gay. But actually he DID choose to be gay. We all have feelings we don't choose (or do choose). We choose to feel hatred towards someone or a certain group of people (which would make us bigots), or to feel love for someone other than our spouses (which would make us adulterers) or chose to feel love and have a sexual relationship with someone of our own sex. Those feelings aren't choices but we do choose whether or not to act on them. Like you, I choose to be heterosexual but that's not my particular bent towards sin. It wasn't sex for me, it was drugs when I was younger and alcohol as I grew older. I choose to follow my 'desires' for them but then came a point in my life when I decided to follow Christ and I choose not to indulge in those desires anymore.

We all have feelings at times which aren't necessarily right and which we shouldn't give in to. And just because we have these feelings doesn't mean God gave them to us. I have feelings too that I have to resist. God ask me to take up my crosses daily and follow Him and live obediently. That means giving up my 'self'. And if part of my 'self' is my proclivity towards a sexual desire that is wrong than I will give that particular sin up.

Plenty of people have 'selves' too, by the way. They may choose to indulge their 'selves' but as Christians I'm called to something different. I'm not here to satisfy my 'self', I'm here to lose them. In the long run that's the only way to really find our true 'selves' anyway.

What a wonderful answer! Thank you, sincerely. Well said.

 

[baydoll]

A distinction without a difference. They sent a clear message that if you don't think the way I do I refuse to have anything to do with you. If Jesus had taken this position Matthew would have never been a disciple.

You're forgetting that Jesus also told people to 'go and sin no more'. And as for His followers, He told them to obey His commandments.

 

[baydoll]

I am making a judgment about what they DID, not who they are. If I owned a business, I wouldn’t refuse them anymore than I would refuse a gay couple or anyone else for that matter. What better way to tell folks that God loves them than to act in a way that shows God loves them? These people conveyed the message that God doesn’t love them because they are gay. It apparently needs to be stated over and over… love the sinner, hate the sin.

But you're completely ignoring the other things Jesus said.

 

[baydoll]

Did Matthew change his ways?

You all keep saying that Jesus served the sinners. He did not. He saved the sinners. Brought them out of their sinful ways. He did not go about this by saying "what you are doing is ok, keep doing it". He said "go forth and sin no more".



Here Jesus is telling us that when he finds the lost sheep (sinner) and brings him back to the flock (out of it's sinful ways) life is grand. No where in this parable did Jesus say that he and the lost sheep hung out together enjoying grass....

Good post, Makavide.

 

[baydoll]

What a wonderful answer! Thank you, sincerely. Well said.

Thank you, Larry! That means a lot to me. Really. You made my day!

Hope you had a very happy Father's Day yesterday!

 

[Zguy28]

Did Matthew change his ways?

You all keep saying that Jesus served the sinners. He did not. He saved the sinners. Brought them out of their sinful ways. He did not go about this by saying "what you are doing is ok, keep doing it". He said "go forth and sin no more".



Here Jesus is telling us that when he finds the lost sheep (sinner) and brings him back to the flock (out of it's sinful ways) life is grand. No where in this parable did Jesus say that he and the lost sheep hung out together enjoying grass....

“…just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” – Matthew 20:28



Where would Matthew had been if Jesus hadn't come into his life? The point I’m trying to make is Jesus did not choose so-called ‘upstanding’ people of the temple or from high, learned places within the Sanhedrin. He chose lowly people; people that were considered to be of questionable character. Why did he do this? Why don’t Christians today do this? They stick to themselves and reject everyone else. Kind of the same thing Jesus lambasted the leaders of the temples of those days (Matthew 23).

You are both correct.

 

[baydoll]

You are both correct.

Exactly.

Jesus loves the sinner but also loves us enough to not leave us in that condition. Jesus is also about transformation.

 

[PsyOps]

But you're completely ignoring the other things Jesus said.

Such as?

 

[Monello]

In this situation they are both being douche bags.

Or they are both sticking up for what they believe to be right.

 

[baydoll]

Such as?

Go and sin no more?