Why Newtown victim Noah Pozner had an open coffin

[aps45819]

I will admit that she has a gun control agenda.

aka wrong

 

[thatguy]

Wirelessly posted

I was also not wrong about aps claim that she "blames the gun" is a strawman.

This action is necessary because as long as these kinds of weapons are able to be purchased by civilians, individuals will use them to kill innocent people.

:shrug:

You do know what "individuals will use them" means don't you

 

[BigBlue]

Apparently she wasn't paying attention to the saga of Cindy Sheehan or she'd know that it's not a good idea to get in bed with these people. They do not care about her grief, nor do they give two ####s about her son. All they care about is pimping her out to further their agenda. Once she is no longer useful, they'll feed her to the dogs.

Oh, like you do???More power to her!!!

 

[PsyOps]

Oh, like you do???More power to her!!!

 

[thatguy]

Wirelessly posted

Oh, like you do???More power to her!!!

Now that it is clear they had a closed casket for the funeral do you want to revise your assessment of this lady's mental health? Seems like her choices for the funeral were pretty normal....

 

[PsyOps]

Now that it is clear they had a closed casket for the funeral do you want to revise your assessment of this lady's mental health? Seems like her choices for the funeral were pretty normal....

As usual, reading comprehension is not your friend. From the OP article:

Mallick: Why Newtown victim Noah Pozner had an open coffin | Toronto Star

Why Newtown victim Noah Pozner had an open coffin

His mother, Veronique, insisted on an open coffin, Naomi Zeveloff reported in the Jewish Daily Forward.

 

[abcxyz]

I bet she took pictures, wonder when she will FB them out.

 

[thatguy]

As usual, reading comprehension is not your friend. From the OP article:

Mallick: Why Newtown victim Noah Pozner had an open coffin | Toronto Star

here is the full eulogy, casket closed.

Noah Pozner's Mother Remembers Her 'Little Man' - YouTube

The OP references an editorial that references a story in another paper, that sotry actually references another story. you probably should have read the actual articles, not just the opinion piece.......

if you bothered to follow the first link you would have seen this:

Veronique told me that Connecticut Governor Dannel Malloy visited her in the funeral home, and she brought him to see Noah’s open casket. I asked her why it was important for her and for the governor to see Noah’s body. “I needed it to have a face for him,” she said. “If there is ever a piece of legislation that comes across his desk, I needed it to be real for him.”

Veronique continued on in this vein for a few minutes. But I still felt that I didn’t understand why she, as a mother, chose to see Noah’s body, so I asked her again: Why, for her? “I owed it to him as his mother, the good, the bad, the ugly,” she said. “It is not up to me to say I am only going to look at you and deal with you when you are alive, that I am going to block out the reality of what you look like when you are dead. And as a little boy, you have to go in the ground. If I am going to shut my eyes to that I am not his mother. I had to bear it. I had to do it.” Several family members also chose to view Noah’s body.

Veronique asked the medical examiners not to autopsy her son; she felt that his body had suffered too many indignities. At his funeral, Noah was dressed in a suit and tie. A Jewish friend of Veronique’s at work enjoined Rabbi Praver to allow him to be wrapped in a blue tallis, even though he had not yet had a bar mitzvah.

The family placed stuffed animals, a blanket and letters to Noah into the casket. Lastly, Veronique put a clear plastic rock with a white angel inside — an “angel stone” — in his right hand. She asked the funeral director to place an identical one in his left, which was badly mangled.

Just before the ceremony, Connecticut Governor Dannel Malloy came to the funeral home to pay his respects. Veronique took him by the arm and brought him to the casket. Noah’s famously long eyelashes — which she spoke about in her eulogy — rested lightly on his cheeks and a cloth covered the place where the lower half of his face had been. “I just needed it to be real for [the governor],” she says. “This was a live, warm, energetic little boy whose life was snuffed out in a fraction of a second because our schools are so defenseless.”


Read more: Noah Pozner's Family Remembers and Mourns

NO WHERE do either of the actual stories say Pozner's mother insisted on an open casket for the funeral or any public viewing.

you want to admit you are wrong yet?

 

[MarieB]

I don't think you can assume from the highlighted portions that it wasn't an open casket for all viewing.


Anyway, I was just reading this and she does address Lanza and his mother and her detailed thoughts about changes that she would like to see made.


DANBURY, Conn. -- In one dream, 6-year-old Noah brushes his teeth at the sink, his dark hair wet. He looks directly at his mother and says, "Mommy, I'm having fun." In another, Veronique Pozner gives birth atop a mountain, is handed the infant by a midwife and walks down a long flight of stairs back to a village. But she drops the baby.

"When I got to the bottom, the baby was dead," Pozner says, crying.

Since the massacre last month at Sandy Hook Elementary School, Pozner has struggled with the gaping hole left by the loss of her energetic, affectionate son. She has tried to help her other children cope and make sense of the senseless. And she has managed to lead her family in pushing for reforms from the White House.

"What's the alternative?" the 45-year-old oncology nurse told The Associated Press in an interview this week. "Not getting out of bed? I don't think Noah would want to see me like that, although sometimes it is hard to get out of bed."

Gunman Adam Lanza killed his mother at home, shot his way into the school Dec. 14, killed 20 first-graders and six educators, and committed suicide as police arrived, according to investigators. They said the mother and son fired at shooting ranges and also visited ranges together.

Pozner says she believes the woman was negligent.

"I think he had a mother who at best was blind; at worst aided and abetted him," she says. "Maybe she wanted to compensate for his feelings of inadequacy by letting him handle weapons of mass carnage and taking him to shooting ranges. I think there was gross irresponsibility, and I'd like to think that maybe she was just as unwell as he was to have allowed someone as obviously compromised as he was to have access."

Veronique Pozner, Newtown Mom, Dreams About Son, Urges Gun Law Reform

 

[aps45819]

OK, you were wrong






...again

 

[MarieB]

“It makes no logical sense. . . . If their wallets were threatened, they would have a greater interest in making firearms safer,” Veronique Pozner, whose 6-year-old son, Noah, was one of the 20 children killed at Sandy Hook, told reporters. Pozner is exploring a possible lawsuit against the maker of the semiautomatic rifle used in the crime, alleging its failure to install a high-tech safety device that could have prevented Adam Lanza from firing the gun was negligent.

Top Stories - 8-Year-Old Law Protects Gun Makers from Lawsuits by Shooting Victims - AllGov - News








Veronique Pozner, whose 6-year-old son Noah was among the 20 students killed at the elementary school, declined to comment about what was said during the meeting but said she was concerned about what authorities didn't tell the families about Lanza's mental state at the time of the shootings.
Pozner said that because of state law, investigators couldn't share information about whether the gunman was being treated by a mental health professional, whether he was taking any medications or what his school records may or may not show about his mental state.
"It would benefit society to know what his mental health, or lack thereof, was at the time of the crime and leading up to it," she said. "We should be able to conduct a psychological autopsy of this individual with the focus of preventing something like this from happening again."
Pozner said she also wanted to know if Lanza was being treated by a mental health care professional, if the individual treating him was aware that he had access to guns and that he was being taken to shooting ranges by his parents.
"In all the other mass murder cases I've heard about, there were always warning signs," Pozner said.


Read more: Families briefed on Sandy Hook shootings probe - GreenwichTime

 

[PsyOps]

Originally Posted by the story about the actual story that the opinion pice references
Veronique told me that Connecticut Governor Dannel Malloy visited her in the funeral home, and she brought him to see Noah’s open casket. I asked her why it was important for her and for the governor to see Noah’s body. “I needed it to have a face for him,” she said. “If there is ever a piece of legislation that comes across his desk, I needed it to be real for him.”

Veronique continued on in this vein for a few minutes. But I still felt that I didn’t understand why she, as a mother, chose to see Noah’s body, so I asked her again: Why, for her? “I owed it to him as his mother, the good, the bad, the ugly,” she said. “It is not up to me to say I am only going to look at you and deal with you when you are alive, that I am going to block out the reality of what you look like when you are dead. And as a little boy, you have to go in the ground. If I am going to shut my eyes to that I am not his mother. I had to bear it. I had to do it.” Several family members also chose to view Noah’s body.

NO WHERE do either of the actual stories say Pozner's mother insisted on an open casket for the funeral or any public viewing.

you want to admit you are wrong yet?

I really don't like being belligerent and disrespectful, but you have to be the most dense person I’ve ever seen. It’s right in your own article YOU posted that there was an OPEN CASKET. You are working so hard to find any little thing to be right. It’s so important to you to be right when you’ve been proven wrong. I don’t know what the medical term is for this but you have it bad. And the worst part is everyone is trying to tell you and you still deny it. And you called me deranged. The only thing that makes me deranged is that I even continue to bother with you.

 

[thatguy]

Wirelessly posted

Originally Posted by the story about the actual story that the opinion pice references
Veronique told me that Connecticut Governor Dannel Malloy visited her in the funeral home, and she brought him to see Noah's open casket. I asked her why it was important for her and for the governor to see Noah's body. "I needed it to have a face for him," she said. "If there is ever a piece of legislation that comes across his desk, I needed it to be real for him."

Veronique continued on in this vein for a few minutes. But I still felt that I didn't understand why she, as a mother, chose to see Noah's body, so I asked her again: Why, for her? "I owed it to him as his mother, the good, the bad, the ugly," she said. "It is not up to me to say I am only going to look at you and deal with you when you are alive, that I am going to block out the reality of what you look like when you are dead. And as a little boy, you have to go in the ground. If I am going to shut my eyes to that I am not his mother. I had to bear it. I had to do it." Several family members also chose to view Noah's body.

NO WHERE do either of the actual stories say Pozner's mother insisted on an open casket for the funeral or any public viewing.

you want to admit you are wrong yet?

I really don't like being belligerent and disrespectful, but you have to be the most dense person I've ever seen. It's right in your own article YOU posted that there was an OPEN CASKET. You are working so hard to find any little thing to be right. It's so important to you to be right when you've been proven wrong. I don't know what the medical term is for this but you have it bad. And the worst part is everyone is trying to tell you and you still deny it. And you called me deranged. The only thing that makes me deranged is that I even continue to bother with you.

You have to read the actual article to get to the fact that the casket was open prior to the ceremony and that only some of the family chose to view it then. She took the gov to see the casket prior to the ceremony, as in it wasnt open during the funeral.

The video clearly shows the casket was not open during the funeral.

 

[PsyOps]

You have to read the actual article to get to the fact that the casket was open prior to the ceremony and that only some of the family chose to view it then. She took the gov to see the casket prior to the ceremony, as in it wasnt open during the funeral.

The video clearly shows the casket was not open during the funeral.

If you go back the very beginning of this thread, folks (even people interviewing Veronique Pozner) were wondering why she decided to have an open casket at all. It doesn't matter when she did it or who she did it for. And that she did not do it for her son, but for political reasons; she has an anti-gun agenda (which you've admitted she does) and she used her son's dismembered body to promote it. It's been stated by a couple of people that rational people don't do this. There are other ways to make your point, but to display your dismember child to anyone, let alone for political reasons, is disturbing to most folks.

You, in your typical desire to just disagree with people, decided to find anything - ANYTHING - just prove people wrong.

 

[thatguy]

Wirelessly posted

You have to read the actual article to get to the fact that the casket was open prior to the ceremony and that only some of the family chose to view it then. She took the gov to see the casket prior to the ceremony, as in it wasnt open during the funeral.

The video clearly shows the casket was not open during the funeral.

If you go back the very beginning of this thread, folks (even people interviewing Veronique Pozner) were wondering why she decided to have an open casket at all. It doesn't matter when she did it or who she did it for. And that she did not do it for her son, but for political reasons; she has an anti-gun agenda (which you've admitted she does) and she used her son's dismembered body to promote it. It's been stated by a couple of people that rational people don't do this. There are other ways to make your point, but to display your dismember child to anyone, let alone for political reasons, is disturbing to most folks.

You, in your typical desire to just disagree with people, decided to find anything - ANYTHING - just prove people wrong.

And that's just it, she didn't display his dismembered body. It matters a lot when she did it and who she did it for. A private viewing with an open casket is normal, even when a loved one has been murdered. I have attested to as much and so have many others. A parent should be able to unerstand that a mother wants to see her child before he is burried. I thought this mothers explaination was particularly good. Having a private viewing is normal and part of the grieving process for many.

There was nothing outrageous about her choices and you shouldn't have questioned her sanity or insinuated that she must have been paid off.

 

[PsyOps]

A private viewing with an open casket is normal, even when a loved one has been murdered.

Not for a child who is missing their lower jaw. And the mother did it purely for political reasons. That's what you're not getting from this. You might think it's normal to display a CHILD that had his jaw blown off to family and limits friends; but most people don't. The people that wrote these articles and interviewed the mother thought it was odd too; because they asked why she did it. And she said why... political reasons... she wanted gun-control legistlation to be the result. Using her own dismember child for political reasons. I am reasonably disturbed by this.

 

[MarieB]

On a side note, I have a question about her request/ insistence that no autopsy be performed. I wouldn't think that there would even be that option

 

[PsyOps]

On a side note, I have a question about her request/ insistence that no autopsy be performed. I wouldn't think that there would even be that option

Why would there need to be an autopsy?

 

[MarieB]

Why would there need to be an autopsy?

I would think due to a criminal investigation, but what do I know

 

[thatguy]

Wirelessly posted

A private viewing with an open casket is normal, even when a loved one has been murdered.

Not for a child who is missing their lower jaw. And the mother did it purely for political reasons. That's what you're not getting from this. You might think it's normal to display a CHILD that had his jaw blown off to family and limits friends; but most people don't. The people that wrote these articles and interviewed the mother thought it was odd too; because they asked why she did it. And she said why... political reasons... she wanted gun-control legistlation to be the result. Using her own dismember child for political reasons. I am reasonably disturbed by this.

So now you speak for most people?

You must not be a parent if you can't empathize with this woman and unerstand why, even after reading her reasons, she would have an open casket for a private viewing. Her reason, not political, but because she loves her son.

If it was truely political why didn't she "insist on an open casket" for the funeral which was public and recorded?